Finding meaning in life.
-1
Hey guys, BigLundi here...as is evident from my username...>.>
Anyhow, after making my topic where I ask people to tell the story of why they believe or don't believe what they do or don't believe, I found one particular response by Lelouch24x to be...a bit daunting.
Lelouch gave 3 main reasons he is still a christian, and one of them made me furrow my brow, and that's the notion that if there isn't a god, and we're all here by purely natural occurrences and circumstances, then there is no meaning to life...and that's a depressing thought.
I thought about how I wanted to tackle this subject, and I figured on a three part post. The first part will be how an atheist can give an account of a meaning of life. The second is how I feel believing in the supernatural doesn't at all ADD to the metaphysical subject of "why are we here?" and the third is a personal account of what I feel the meaning of life is...for me at least.
Firstly, those who do not believe the supernatural exists, or actively believe that supernatural things in fact do not exist, are not barred from finding meaning in life. This meaning can be assigned from the Subject, and, in my opinion, is no less meaningful than a meaning derived from some supernatural creator being.
For instance, an atheist might make the life goal to reach a certain status in life, have so many children, a spouse, a job, a home, and stability. The meaning in this life would be to reach the goal the atheist has assigned himself or herself. "So what if they reach that goal? What then?" I hear you ask. Well then they can just as easily come up with new goals. The assignment of new goals doesn't diminish the meaning of the past goals anymore than beating a video game and moving onto another one diminishes how good the first game was when you played it.
Theistically, I find no further significance in saying that you receive your meaning from a god. Supposing a god does exist, and this is the guy that's giving you meaning...who says you have to acknowledge the meaning assigned to you? Ultimately it's your choice to accept this meaning or not.
Say God has made the meaning of the Subject's life to help others, and even directly tells him/her he wants him/her to be a doctor or something. There's nothing stopping you from rejecting this, and deciding instead to become an actor. The meaning of the Subject's life still, either with a god or without it, depends on what the Subject wants it to be.
If you say that it only counts to have a meaning from God because he created you, I would ask if the same right to assign meaning wouldn't then in turn be given to your parents as well? And if this can be reduced to mere human normativity, then wouldn't it also follow that the Subject in question could still assign the meaning to themselves?
To draw another analogy to video games, let us say God is a game designer, and life is his game. He has a particular idea in mind when he made the game of how he wants it to be played, what he wants to be done with it, the rules he wants to be played.
However when that game goes into shipment, and is played by people...there is nothing forcing them to play exactly as the game designer desired. They can make up their own rules, their own goals in the game, enjoy it however they want, while completely ignoring the game designer's original meaning, if they desired.
Take WoW for instance. The point of the game can easily be discerned. Level up, quest, collect loot, do raids and dungeons.
But what if someone decided that these were silly? And decided instead the point of the game was to mine every node in the game? Or that they simply stay at level 1 and roleplay with other players? Some people are simply satisfied by riding around and enjoying the scenery therapeutically. It's all the choice of the player how they wish to enjoy their time.
As for me, I derive my meaning in recognizing that which I enjoy and desire.
I am most satisfied with the major questions of life, concerning morality, metaphysics, and science. It's my goal not only to learn what I can about these subjects, but to inspire others to do the same. Hence the meaning of my life is to gain a PhD in philosophy and teach it to students in a university, inspiring the same love for questioning the world that I have.
I ask...what makes my self assigned meaning of life any less...meaningful, than someone else who claims to get their meaning from a god?
Thank you for reading. :)
TL;DR
We give ourselves meaning to our lives, even if a god exists and tried to dictate what those meanings are supposed to be.
Anyhow, after making my topic where I ask people to tell the story of why they believe or don't believe what they do or don't believe, I found one particular response by Lelouch24x to be...a bit daunting.
Lelouch gave 3 main reasons he is still a christian, and one of them made me furrow my brow, and that's the notion that if there isn't a god, and we're all here by purely natural occurrences and circumstances, then there is no meaning to life...and that's a depressing thought.
I thought about how I wanted to tackle this subject, and I figured on a three part post. The first part will be how an atheist can give an account of a meaning of life. The second is how I feel believing in the supernatural doesn't at all ADD to the metaphysical subject of "why are we here?" and the third is a personal account of what I feel the meaning of life is...for me at least.
Firstly, those who do not believe the supernatural exists, or actively believe that supernatural things in fact do not exist, are not barred from finding meaning in life. This meaning can be assigned from the Subject, and, in my opinion, is no less meaningful than a meaning derived from some supernatural creator being.
For instance, an atheist might make the life goal to reach a certain status in life, have so many children, a spouse, a job, a home, and stability. The meaning in this life would be to reach the goal the atheist has assigned himself or herself. "So what if they reach that goal? What then?" I hear you ask. Well then they can just as easily come up with new goals. The assignment of new goals doesn't diminish the meaning of the past goals anymore than beating a video game and moving onto another one diminishes how good the first game was when you played it.
Theistically, I find no further significance in saying that you receive your meaning from a god. Supposing a god does exist, and this is the guy that's giving you meaning...who says you have to acknowledge the meaning assigned to you? Ultimately it's your choice to accept this meaning or not.
Say God has made the meaning of the Subject's life to help others, and even directly tells him/her he wants him/her to be a doctor or something. There's nothing stopping you from rejecting this, and deciding instead to become an actor. The meaning of the Subject's life still, either with a god or without it, depends on what the Subject wants it to be.
If you say that it only counts to have a meaning from God because he created you, I would ask if the same right to assign meaning wouldn't then in turn be given to your parents as well? And if this can be reduced to mere human normativity, then wouldn't it also follow that the Subject in question could still assign the meaning to themselves?
To draw another analogy to video games, let us say God is a game designer, and life is his game. He has a particular idea in mind when he made the game of how he wants it to be played, what he wants to be done with it, the rules he wants to be played.
However when that game goes into shipment, and is played by people...there is nothing forcing them to play exactly as the game designer desired. They can make up their own rules, their own goals in the game, enjoy it however they want, while completely ignoring the game designer's original meaning, if they desired.
Take WoW for instance. The point of the game can easily be discerned. Level up, quest, collect loot, do raids and dungeons.
But what if someone decided that these were silly? And decided instead the point of the game was to mine every node in the game? Or that they simply stay at level 1 and roleplay with other players? Some people are simply satisfied by riding around and enjoying the scenery therapeutically. It's all the choice of the player how they wish to enjoy their time.
As for me, I derive my meaning in recognizing that which I enjoy and desire.
I am most satisfied with the major questions of life, concerning morality, metaphysics, and science. It's my goal not only to learn what I can about these subjects, but to inspire others to do the same. Hence the meaning of my life is to gain a PhD in philosophy and teach it to students in a university, inspiring the same love for questioning the world that I have.
I ask...what makes my self assigned meaning of life any less...meaningful, than someone else who claims to get their meaning from a god?
Thank you for reading. :)
TL;DR
We give ourselves meaning to our lives, even if a god exists and tried to dictate what those meanings are supposed to be.
0
Meaning in life? This is a sad question. But then, English is a sad language. It always wants something.
If we could ever just stop looking for a meaning to life, or meanings and explanations for everything, maybe we would just see things for what they are for a minute. And what they are is a lot more 'meaningful' than an arbitrary unforgiving god figure. Or a savior figure. Or any one thing or person or construct you might care to place 'meaning' onto.
Our so called 'language' does not cover this subject. It never will be able to. What we're really discussing here, are things beyond the grasp of our feeble brains. Luckily, there's more to us than just a brain. We are not the sum of our neurons. Maybe one day even science will start to really grapple with this, but so far they haven't bothered.
Try observing yourself sometime. Just go about your day but observe what it is your doing, and far more importantly, WHY are you doing it? Then think about this. Who is the one observing you? Are you the observer, or the observed? Are you both?
Are we whatever our neural networks can construct on the fly, whether that's one person or a whole series of personas? Masks? How is it doing that anyway? Individual neurons at best store half or a third of a thought. It needs exactly the right connection to complete itself. What directs those connections? Is that the observer observing the self? Or is that another fantasy cooked up by your little brain?
Nah, I'm just messing with you! If we're all 100% honest, then we don't know shit. That's all I got to say.
If we could ever just stop looking for a meaning to life, or meanings and explanations for everything, maybe we would just see things for what they are for a minute. And what they are is a lot more 'meaningful' than an arbitrary unforgiving god figure. Or a savior figure. Or any one thing or person or construct you might care to place 'meaning' onto.
Our so called 'language' does not cover this subject. It never will be able to. What we're really discussing here, are things beyond the grasp of our feeble brains. Luckily, there's more to us than just a brain. We are not the sum of our neurons. Maybe one day even science will start to really grapple with this, but so far they haven't bothered.
Try observing yourself sometime. Just go about your day but observe what it is your doing, and far more importantly, WHY are you doing it? Then think about this. Who is the one observing you? Are you the observer, or the observed? Are you both?
Are we whatever our neural networks can construct on the fly, whether that's one person or a whole series of personas? Masks? How is it doing that anyway? Individual neurons at best store half or a third of a thought. It needs exactly the right connection to complete itself. What directs those connections? Is that the observer observing the self? Or is that another fantasy cooked up by your little brain?
Nah, I'm just messing with you! If we're all 100% honest, then we don't know shit. That's all I got to say.
0
It's funny you would come up with such a topic, I speculated over this very topic a couple months ago and came to the conclusion life was, indeed pointless.
A depressing thought indeed. To know that all one's years on this planet will have no overall substantial effect on this universe, or our planet, or for some even our society. One day when we cease to exist, all that is left of us is the memories in other minds and perhaps our grave stone. Then that will surely disappear too. Just think how many people in history have been forgotten and how many incidents have been hidden or lied about. Life is a question which will haunt humanity forever.
However, life is still what you make of it, kinda' like that game Little Big Planet lol.
I have my own personal moral concept for life: 'Do whatever hell I want to' (provided it doesn't clash with my own beliefs). It's works fine for me, though I wouldn't suggest everyone to use it >_>
As homo-sapiens, are literal purpose is to die. Well, after you've lived your life of course, but generally we live to die. However, the meaning of life always brings me to 'what is after death', I don't particularly believe in heaven, but lately I've been pondering over the speculation of a soul and if it really exists.
They say when someone dies they lose around 21 pounds of weight, someone once told me that this was the soul leaving the body. I was sceptical about it at first, but then I started considering it because of my very own existence. I mean, can I really just be a mass of particles which seems to have logic and reasoning, enough so to even question life. What really makes me, me?
I seem to have drifted from the original notion, my apologies. I think you're right in saying that we give ourselves meaning, but there is something err, still missing somewhere in our understanding of this rather complicated concept we call 'life'.
A depressing thought indeed. To know that all one's years on this planet will have no overall substantial effect on this universe, or our planet, or for some even our society. One day when we cease to exist, all that is left of us is the memories in other minds and perhaps our grave stone. Then that will surely disappear too. Just think how many people in history have been forgotten and how many incidents have been hidden or lied about. Life is a question which will haunt humanity forever.
However, life is still what you make of it, kinda' like that game Little Big Planet lol.
I have my own personal moral concept for life: 'Do whatever hell I want to' (provided it doesn't clash with my own beliefs). It's works fine for me, though I wouldn't suggest everyone to use it >_>
As homo-sapiens, are literal purpose is to die. Well, after you've lived your life of course, but generally we live to die. However, the meaning of life always brings me to 'what is after death', I don't particularly believe in heaven, but lately I've been pondering over the speculation of a soul and if it really exists.
They say when someone dies they lose around 21 pounds of weight, someone once told me that this was the soul leaving the body. I was sceptical about it at first, but then I started considering it because of my very own existence. I mean, can I really just be a mass of particles which seems to have logic and reasoning, enough so to even question life. What really makes me, me?
I seem to have drifted from the original notion, my apologies. I think you're right in saying that we give ourselves meaning, but there is something err, still missing somewhere in our understanding of this rather complicated concept we call 'life'.
0
Life is just like a diamond, it has no purpose yet it extremely valuable, do you know why? The answer is because humans want it to have extreme value. However, if there is no living being who claims it have value then the diamond is worthless.
This what brings up the notion that all life is equal. A life of ant is equal to that of a human or any other animal. Why is this true? Let say the life of the ant is equal that 1kg of diamond and the life of human is equal to 10kg of diamond. Normally humans would say that 10kg of diamond is worth more than 1kg, but let say that 1kg was given to you by your deceased mother as a final gift then the value of the 1kg of diamond is far grater than the 10kg. In other words, value of ant can less, equal, or greater than that of human and vice versa, and this apply to all living beings.
I hope I have answer your question.
This what brings up the notion that all life is equal. A life of ant is equal to that of a human or any other animal. Why is this true? Let say the life of the ant is equal that 1kg of diamond and the life of human is equal to 10kg of diamond. Normally humans would say that 10kg of diamond is worth more than 1kg, but let say that 1kg was given to you by your deceased mother as a final gift then the value of the 1kg of diamond is far grater than the 10kg. In other words, value of ant can less, equal, or greater than that of human and vice versa, and this apply to all living beings.
I hope I have answer your question.
0
There was a similar question asked in a scholarship I've recently applied for. I'll post a link in case anyone is interested.
In response to the proposed topic, I need to establish where my view on God is. I believe that God is human, and therefore, imperfect as we are. Does he not show anger? Does he not feel pain, sadness, and wanting? It's because of my beliefs that I cannot bring myself to say I 'fear' God, but somewhat 'understand' him/her (If anything, I feel that God could be both.) My reason's for this is a mundane one: when i was younger, my brother died fighting against his Protein S Deficiency, and that shook me and my beliefs to the core. I went through the seven stages, but all the same, I could never find a way to restore my full belief in him and his word.
Fast Forward a few years to where I am now. After observing the state of the world, and the Christians that seem to attract attention from the media, I've realized something. There's no real point in 'fearing' God. He loves us and just wants to be loved in return. (I could go on about this, eventually breaking into a discussion about the Seven Deadly Sins, but that's not for this forum.) And through this, I've discovered something else:
I do not wish to have any meaning in life; I just want to live my life according to my own standards. I do apply some of the biblical teachings that I grew up with to it as well, but that doesn't stop me from 'sinning.' If anything, I believe sin is encouraged because God needed something to show how one can get into heaven and what to avoid.
TL;RD: I have no meaning in life, nor do I want one.
In response to the proposed topic, I need to establish where my view on God is. I believe that God is human, and therefore, imperfect as we are. Does he not show anger? Does he not feel pain, sadness, and wanting? It's because of my beliefs that I cannot bring myself to say I 'fear' God, but somewhat 'understand' him/her (If anything, I feel that God could be both.) My reason's for this is a mundane one: when i was younger, my brother died fighting against his Protein S Deficiency, and that shook me and my beliefs to the core. I went through the seven stages, but all the same, I could never find a way to restore my full belief in him and his word.
Fast Forward a few years to where I am now. After observing the state of the world, and the Christians that seem to attract attention from the media, I've realized something. There's no real point in 'fearing' God. He loves us and just wants to be loved in return. (I could go on about this, eventually breaking into a discussion about the Seven Deadly Sins, but that's not for this forum.) And through this, I've discovered something else:
I do not wish to have any meaning in life; I just want to live my life according to my own standards. I do apply some of the biblical teachings that I grew up with to it as well, but that doesn't stop me from 'sinning.' If anything, I believe sin is encouraged because God needed something to show how one can get into heaven and what to avoid.
TL;RD: I have no meaning in life, nor do I want one.
0
I think less about the meaning of life and more about the meaning humans derive from death. This is to say that because there is a definite end for everyone humans strive to make their life worth something. This self generated goal that an individual seeks out is my idea of the meaning of life. In essence I feel that this is just what people come up with to comfort themselves with the idea of death. "If I can make a mark on the world then I will be remembered" type of thought. Because of this I feel there is no true meaning behind the answer to the meaning of life question it will vary between individuals. The only real benefit the answer/goal someone comes up with is the mental support humans need in order to cope with the idea of death.
0
Hmmm....Saying that something has meaning usually suggests that the object in question was made with some sort of purpose or intent, right? Considering how im not religious, I dont believe theres an absolute meaning to life. In fact, I believe life is meaningless. Well, I suppose you must consider to whom life has meaning. The meaning of life for each person is different and completely subjective. Personally I always try to be a better person, thats my self-assigned mission in life.
To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and to endure the betrayal of false friends. To appreciate beauty; to find the best in others; to leave the world a bit better whether by a healthy child, a garden patch, or a redeemed social condition; to know that even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded. (Ralph Waldo Emerson)
To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and to endure the betrayal of false friends. To appreciate beauty; to find the best in others; to leave the world a bit better whether by a healthy child, a garden patch, or a redeemed social condition; to know that even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded. (Ralph Waldo Emerson)
0
I counter this quetion with another one: Why do we yern for a meaning? Do we really need to know it? After all, we may have already fulfilled our meaning. Then again, our meaning could be a long away goal that it seems we will never reach or it could be right in front of us. But what do we succeed from find the meening of life? Do we plan to fulfill it? Do we plan to ignore it? If we do fulfill it doesn't that mean life would no longer have meaning?
My point is that sum things are better left unknown. If we know the meaning of life what's left to drive us? We would have nothing to look for or figure out. Life would be boring without meaning and death will be the only thing left for us.
Sorry if a depressed you.
My point is that sum things are better left unknown. If we know the meaning of life what's left to drive us? We would have nothing to look for or figure out. Life would be boring without meaning and death will be the only thing left for us.
Sorry if a depressed you.