Voting in the USA
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So I know there have been topics about this in the past but I want to generate more of a discussion and talk about ... actual talking points rather than this or that. This is not necessarily a political thread (and I'd prefer if it isn't).
I'll just get this out of the way. I think everyone should vote and I think everyone voting should go out of their way to educate themselves about contemporary politics. And while I don't think this needs to be the focus of the discussion (it seems that) there are a lot of people who don't vote one for some reason or many reasons. People probably don't vote because there are a lot, no there are countless problems in politics and also because those problems are frequently an easy excuse to disregard the vote. So let's talk about those things, shall we? I'll go through my thoughts in no particular order except for the first which I myself was guilty of thinking.
The vote is a choice of the lesser of two evils. This is sometimes the truth and it's hard to blame people for thinking this way because there are a lot of things contributing to this problem. Neither candidate may represent you particularly well or at all. First of all we have a two party system. Having an attractive third-party candidate only serves as a spoiler and so the least favorable candidate may be elected because the "sensible" voters were divided. This is often explained by our voting process, First Past the Post Voting. And to make it worse the alternatives to FPTP voting all have their own problems. There straight up isn't a perfect voting system. But our system does suck pretty badly. But I think people should still vote. The 2012 Presidential election was pretty simple for me. Regardless of what you think of President Obama, his Republican opponent was a clown. I don't know how Mitt Romney would have fared in office and I don't want to know. The guy bounced on issues, said some really terrible things, and it seemed as though he simply lacked intelligence in general (also his running partner was the biggest douche). Even if Obama isn't who people wanted, the greater evil here seemed a lot worse. Additionally if you believe the voting system is flawed it's on you to vote for candidates who call for reforms in the election process.
The election process is a lose-lose for me and the only way to win is to not play the game. If you acknowledge that there are problems (and there countless problems) then not addressing them only helps to perpetuate those problems. It's not even that much of a stretch to say that doing nothing is also being part of the problem. And it's very hard to believe that your voice and your vote have any real effect. You can never really be sure. But I think people should still vote. Because doing nothing is just as bad as voting for the person who represents you the least.
I'm not an informed voter so I shouldn't vote. Politics is just confusing and difficult. Well yeah it is hard. Staying informed is very difficult. There are lies flying around everywhere, its hard to know what's right and what's wrong. Reading articles can be very misleading because people can make a very convincing argument without being right at all. Politicians just make the problems worse by picking convenient words that strike people's nerves. It's difficult. But a lot of things in life are difficult. Unfortunately without contemporary government our world wouldn't be much better than feudalism. I'm frightened by the thought of gangs and mafia controlling civilization in broad daylight. That was slightly off topic but the government matters enough that people should stay informed. If something happens while you weren't watching that's on you because you prioritize other things over politics. If shit really does hit the fan you can't just blame it on shitty politics. You have a voice and a vote. Use them intelligently. And it's easier than ever to stay informed. The internet is constantly buzzing with this stuff. Social media and press are all over the net. I frequent reddit a lot where people are always posting. And while reddit is very circlejerky you do occasionally get people offering different perspectives worth considering. It's really not that hard despite being somewhat time consuming.
The system is completely broken. My vote isn't even counted. Dollars are the only votes getting counted here and I don't have enough money for my voice to matter. Well, maybe. But even if you believe something like this is true it doesn't actually hurt to try. You don't have to pay to vote (and if you do something must be terribly wrong). Even if you have doubts about the system vote anyway on the slight chance that it's actually legitimate.
My vote is just a drop in the ocean. It doesn't even matter. For every "sensible" person voting (or not voting) there's an unintelligent zombie whose vote was bought by cheap words and promises. Not voting makes it easier to elect their candidates. Yes your vote is one in millions but there are many, many people who think the same way. Convincing a single person to vote may not have any significance in the bigger picture but surely you've heard the expression that "every penny counts". What's more, you have a voice too, so voicing it weights more heavily than your single vote. Use it or lose it! Wouldn't it be natural to complain if your right to vote was taken away?
These sorts of long posts tire me out and I forget a lot of talking points. Anyway discuss~
I'll just get this out of the way. I think everyone should vote and I think everyone voting should go out of their way to educate themselves about contemporary politics. And while I don't think this needs to be the focus of the discussion (it seems that) there are a lot of people who don't vote one for some reason or many reasons. People probably don't vote because there are a lot, no there are countless problems in politics and also because those problems are frequently an easy excuse to disregard the vote. So let's talk about those things, shall we? I'll go through my thoughts in no particular order except for the first which I myself was guilty of thinking.
The vote is a choice of the lesser of two evils. This is sometimes the truth and it's hard to blame people for thinking this way because there are a lot of things contributing to this problem. Neither candidate may represent you particularly well or at all. First of all we have a two party system. Having an attractive third-party candidate only serves as a spoiler and so the least favorable candidate may be elected because the "sensible" voters were divided. This is often explained by our voting process, First Past the Post Voting. And to make it worse the alternatives to FPTP voting all have their own problems. There straight up isn't a perfect voting system. But our system does suck pretty badly. But I think people should still vote. The 2012 Presidential election was pretty simple for me. Regardless of what you think of President Obama, his Republican opponent was a clown. I don't know how Mitt Romney would have fared in office and I don't want to know. The guy bounced on issues, said some really terrible things, and it seemed as though he simply lacked intelligence in general (also his running partner was the biggest douche). Even if Obama isn't who people wanted, the greater evil here seemed a lot worse. Additionally if you believe the voting system is flawed it's on you to vote for candidates who call for reforms in the election process.
The election process is a lose-lose for me and the only way to win is to not play the game. If you acknowledge that there are problems (and there countless problems) then not addressing them only helps to perpetuate those problems. It's not even that much of a stretch to say that doing nothing is also being part of the problem. And it's very hard to believe that your voice and your vote have any real effect. You can never really be sure. But I think people should still vote. Because doing nothing is just as bad as voting for the person who represents you the least.
I'm not an informed voter so I shouldn't vote. Politics is just confusing and difficult. Well yeah it is hard. Staying informed is very difficult. There are lies flying around everywhere, its hard to know what's right and what's wrong. Reading articles can be very misleading because people can make a very convincing argument without being right at all. Politicians just make the problems worse by picking convenient words that strike people's nerves. It's difficult. But a lot of things in life are difficult. Unfortunately without contemporary government our world wouldn't be much better than feudalism. I'm frightened by the thought of gangs and mafia controlling civilization in broad daylight. That was slightly off topic but the government matters enough that people should stay informed. If something happens while you weren't watching that's on you because you prioritize other things over politics. If shit really does hit the fan you can't just blame it on shitty politics. You have a voice and a vote. Use them intelligently. And it's easier than ever to stay informed. The internet is constantly buzzing with this stuff. Social media and press are all over the net. I frequent reddit a lot where people are always posting. And while reddit is very circlejerky you do occasionally get people offering different perspectives worth considering. It's really not that hard despite being somewhat time consuming.
The system is completely broken. My vote isn't even counted. Dollars are the only votes getting counted here and I don't have enough money for my voice to matter. Well, maybe. But even if you believe something like this is true it doesn't actually hurt to try. You don't have to pay to vote (and if you do something must be terribly wrong). Even if you have doubts about the system vote anyway on the slight chance that it's actually legitimate.
My vote is just a drop in the ocean. It doesn't even matter. For every "sensible" person voting (or not voting) there's an unintelligent zombie whose vote was bought by cheap words and promises. Not voting makes it easier to elect their candidates. Yes your vote is one in millions but there are many, many people who think the same way. Convincing a single person to vote may not have any significance in the bigger picture but surely you've heard the expression that "every penny counts". What's more, you have a voice too, so voicing it weights more heavily than your single vote. Use it or lose it! Wouldn't it be natural to complain if your right to vote was taken away?
These sorts of long posts tire me out and I forget a lot of talking points. Anyway discuss~
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I just want to say something in regards to the dollars. Technically you don't need a lot of money to start a Super PAC. In fact the reason you saw a lot of the Tea Party people get into office was because they primaries the Republicans on the grassroots level. The grassroots conservatives aren't particularly wealthy either (not the local level ones, the national ones are very monied though). Dave Brat lost because of a non-wealthy primary challenger that actually booted Cantor out on the basis that Cantor was too pro-establishment. (I believe he was anyways, good riddance)
The most influential voting period is actually the Primaries because those are what gets the most individual attention. Little known secret: Primaries don't attract that many voters so it's the reason why minority groups such as Evangelical and Born-Again Christians wield so much power, they practically make the majority of the primary voters, which is why you saw the mudfest of trying to out-conservative the other guy in the 2012 republican primaries. Because of how small the primaries are in terms of voter numbers it creates a high chance to actually change who the general candidate will be.
Speaking of challengers I dunno why the liberals don't challenge Hillary even though they don't like her. I don't care if Hillary is a woman or not, I'd rather take a stogy old white man over a woman or anything else if that stogy old white man actually did his job and could work across the party aisles.
As for voter numbers, I'm all in for either:
1. Reducing the number of voters (IE, a basic knowledge requirement. If you don't even know some important things like the constitution don't vote, your ignorance will only hurt us. However the Voting Rights Act forbids these kinds of tests because they're "discriminatory")
2. Improving the quality of voters (so we don't pick a braindead stupid candidate. Lip service shouldn't be the most important thing. The policies should be the main focus. Not the sloganizing. Not the identity politics. )
Just my random thoughts.
The most influential voting period is actually the Primaries because those are what gets the most individual attention. Little known secret: Primaries don't attract that many voters so it's the reason why minority groups such as Evangelical and Born-Again Christians wield so much power, they practically make the majority of the primary voters, which is why you saw the mudfest of trying to out-conservative the other guy in the 2012 republican primaries. Because of how small the primaries are in terms of voter numbers it creates a high chance to actually change who the general candidate will be.
Speaking of challengers I dunno why the liberals don't challenge Hillary even though they don't like her. I don't care if Hillary is a woman or not, I'd rather take a stogy old white man over a woman or anything else if that stogy old white man actually did his job and could work across the party aisles.
As for voter numbers, I'm all in for either:
1. Reducing the number of voters (IE, a basic knowledge requirement. If you don't even know some important things like the constitution don't vote, your ignorance will only hurt us. However the Voting Rights Act forbids these kinds of tests because they're "discriminatory")
2. Improving the quality of voters (so we don't pick a braindead stupid candidate. Lip service shouldn't be the most important thing. The policies should be the main focus. Not the sloganizing. Not the identity politics. )
Just my random thoughts.
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People just lacks interest in politics unless something impossible to ignore is happening (like an economical crisis). The unique way to counterattack this natural effect is by teaching people the importance of the whole process and how and why the world works in that way. Of course that requires some of neutral position, a thing hard to find in the highly nationalist U.S, so yeah. People on average is happy with the right VS extreme right wings politics, both in moral and practical effects, so the country works like its people wishes it to do, or in other words, democracy is working.
Though just like in all the world, the higher spheres of power are self selected between them, just needing to be careful about a few topics. The U.S just like most places where democracy works, selects in a fairly a responsible and somewhat stable way their lower ranks, so things at a local level works fancy and dandy.
Now you have corruption, but the U.S has never controlled its own corruption but rather the international community (because a highly corrupt U.S is the worst of nightmares for all the world). It is hard to control corruption when your political ideals are the rule of the strongest and absolute freedom except on what the strongest does not want it. U.S isn't a chaos on corruption thanks for having a variety of different oligarchies clashing between them, rather a single dominant one like on Russia or China.
Though just like in all the world, the higher spheres of power are self selected between them, just needing to be careful about a few topics. The U.S just like most places where democracy works, selects in a fairly a responsible and somewhat stable way their lower ranks, so things at a local level works fancy and dandy.
Now you have corruption, but the U.S has never controlled its own corruption but rather the international community (because a highly corrupt U.S is the worst of nightmares for all the world). It is hard to control corruption when your political ideals are the rule of the strongest and absolute freedom except on what the strongest does not want it. U.S isn't a chaos on corruption thanks for having a variety of different oligarchies clashing between them, rather a single dominant one like on Russia or China.
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Some people don't vote due to whoever gets elected doesn't really affect their daily lives. We had Obama for 6 years and I haven't noticed anything major happen from the political stand point that affected my daily life. So some people will feel there is no point to vote. Also the fact there is a lot of mistrust now in our government. I am not sure if it started with Nixon, but he was a major cause that we can never be sure what underhanded things they are doing. Let alone we seen possible cheating in the voting booths which is more of a reason people get turned away. If a candidate is going to cheat then your vote becomes useless.
Voting is right we have in this country that isn't forced and an individual can use that right or not. I choose to use the right on occasion, but won't go vote cause I can. If I feel I have not bothered to keep up with a candidates objectives and running guidelines then no reason for me to make an uniformed decision or rush to attempt to learn when I find out there is an election.
Voting is right we have in this country that isn't forced and an individual can use that right or not. I choose to use the right on occasion, but won't go vote cause I can. If I feel I have not bothered to keep up with a candidates objectives and running guidelines then no reason for me to make an uniformed decision or rush to attempt to learn when I find out there is an election.