Lolicon.
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Well i m not the kind of guy who take this rules, take me for example pornography in malaysia here is basicly banned here even female underpants is unallowed to be drawn here, but hey who cares + about latest songs download and u upload it on ur page thats nothing i wouldn't even care if they catch me or not just give a look in my thread in anime&manga then u will see and even these stuff is banned i dun give a damn care, basicly just have ur fun and dun care about wat others say.
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paranoia, realise that in the states the government needs a reason to find you. if you stole a car, and you have a penchant for breaking in and enteing, no law enforcment place is going to hunt you down for looking at porn.
but if youve molested 13 girls and raped one catholic priest, thay might frown on you looking at sprots illustrated swimsuit issue let alone lolicon.
for the most part i think youre safe , unless you fit into category b.
personally lolicon just doesnt work for me..it's like gay porn i have absolutely no intrest in it. now lesbians theres a topic i could discuss for hours on end.
at conclusion, we are all here of our own freewill, so be willing to take the punishment if its illegal in your area.
btw first time offenses are really just slaps on the wrist, i should know
but if youve molested 13 girls and raped one catholic priest, thay might frown on you looking at sprots illustrated swimsuit issue let alone lolicon.
for the most part i think youre safe , unless you fit into category b.
personally lolicon just doesnt work for me..it's like gay porn i have absolutely no intrest in it. now lesbians theres a topic i could discuss for hours on end.
at conclusion, we are all here of our own freewill, so be willing to take the punishment if its illegal in your area.
btw first time offenses are really just slaps on the wrist, i should know
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lolicon
Lol ... and I volunteer anyways =/
Plus, the guy was importing. Compared to that, how bad is looking at lolicon?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lolicon
I feel much safer >>"
So the worst they can do is take it away?
Anyways, unless I have some other deviant criminal acts to go along with my loli collection, I don't think it's really risky. Hence the bolded "solely".
Other than that, the laws are stricter in U.S. Yay for living in Canada =D
In October 2005, Canadian courts sentenced an Edmonton, Alberta, man to one year of community service for importing manga depicting child sex, possibly the first manga-related child pornography case in Canada.[10]
Lol ... and I volunteer anyways =/
Plus, the guy was importing. Compared to that, how bad is looking at lolicon?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lolicon
So far, no one has been prosecuted solely for possessing or importing fictional Japanese lolicon in Canada. The current law has primarily been used to compound charges for real child pornography. However, the current law does criminalize possession of purely fictional material, could be applied in cases featuring only images of fictional children in the future, and has been used to prosecute possession of fictional stories with no pictures of real or imaginary children.[12]
I feel much safer >>"
So the worst they can do is take it away?
Anyways, unless I have some other deviant criminal acts to go along with my loli collection, I don't think it's really risky. Hence the bolded "solely".
Other than that, the laws are stricter in U.S. Yay for living in Canada =D
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*lurker mode off*A whole bunch of people in this here thread seem to be assuming that lolicon porn is like some kind of 'gateway drug', meaning the people who view it then start looking for harder stuff. As a confirmed and proud (well, on the internet, at least) loli-lover, I can say that the main reason loli appeals to me (and according to most of my fellow loli-lovers that I've spoken to, this applies to the vast majority of us) is because it isn't real, and has no way it could be real.
To put it another way, it is (much as I dislike admitting it) like being a furfa- I mean a furry fetishist. We get a bad reputation for something which the vast, VAST majority of us would never do. In their case, it's fucking an animal, in ours, fucking a child or looking at child porn. Like most of you, the real stuff makes me physically sick (but then so does Toddlerkon, seriously Japan what the hell SIT IN THE CORNER AND THINK ABOUT WHAT YOU HAVE DONE).
Oh, and the guy who was saying something like "lol i'm australian so i can still download it" should probably be made aware of the fact that Lolicon art has been completely illegal in Australia pretty much since the internet came out. Never stopped me downloading, though, so I don't see why it should stop you.
Leaving that aside, I'm pretty sure you could just stick a "all characters in the pornographic contents of this site are over 18" disclaimer on the front page and the whole thing would be safe. I mean, Etna (<3<3<3) from Disgaea (who is pretty much the hottest thing ever IMO) is technically not loli due to being 1472 years old, so it would probably work. *lurker mode on*
To put it another way, it is (much as I dislike admitting it) like being a furfa- I mean a furry fetishist. We get a bad reputation for something which the vast, VAST majority of us would never do. In their case, it's fucking an animal, in ours, fucking a child or looking at child porn. Like most of you, the real stuff makes me physically sick (but then so does Toddlerkon, seriously Japan what the hell SIT IN THE CORNER AND THINK ABOUT WHAT YOU HAVE DONE).
Oh, and the guy who was saying something like "lol i'm australian so i can still download it" should probably be made aware of the fact that Lolicon art has been completely illegal in Australia pretty much since the internet came out. Never stopped me downloading, though, so I don't see why it should stop you.
Leaving that aside, I'm pretty sure you could just stick a "all characters in the pornographic contents of this site are over 18" disclaimer on the front page and the whole thing would be safe. I mean, Etna (<3<3<3) from Disgaea (who is pretty much the hottest thing ever IMO) is technically not loli due to being 1472 years old, so it would probably work. *lurker mode on*
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well...the only thing i wanna say is that the Bush administration better take care something else more important then this miller test thing :roll:
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Nikon
FAKKU Old Guard
axe lottle
While people are jumping to that conclusion, the biggest matter is the legality of the issue. I have no desire to see FAKKU go down the tubes for something that could have been prevented. I'm not saying other things should go untouched, as they're on the chopping block next... but we as a site get enough traffic daily that it's about time things like these be brought up.
I'm fine with the fact that people like lolicon. As an example, azumax likes it and he's fine in my book. It's just the legal aspect. The owner of the site lives in the US, the site's hosted in the US, and that means we have to follow US laws. Granted, there isn't a specific law regarding lolicon, I wouldn't be surprised if one popped up here soon.
I will admit that cartoons are an alternative, and I respect the people that would never even think of harming a child such, but things have to be looked at from every angle.
I'm glad that you all are participating in this. I would still like to hear the thoughts of our other forum members, as well as more debate from the current posters in the thread.
While people are jumping to that conclusion, the biggest matter is the legality of the issue. I have no desire to see FAKKU go down the tubes for something that could have been prevented. I'm not saying other things should go untouched, as they're on the chopping block next... but we as a site get enough traffic daily that it's about time things like these be brought up.
I'm fine with the fact that people like lolicon. As an example, azumax likes it and he's fine in my book. It's just the legal aspect. The owner of the site lives in the US, the site's hosted in the US, and that means we have to follow US laws. Granted, there isn't a specific law regarding lolicon, I wouldn't be surprised if one popped up here soon.
I will admit that cartoons are an alternative, and I respect the people that would never even think of harming a child such, but things have to be looked at from every angle.
I'm glad that you all are participating in this. I would still like to hear the thoughts of our other forum members, as well as more debate from the current posters in the thread.
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America-bashing and loli-haet aside, if what we're concerned about is legality, the easiest way to avoid the issue is to avoid the issue. Don't post explicit lolicon content openly (or at all) and post a series of criteria by which it should be judged.
4chan doesn't allow CP (child porn) and obviously lolicon content to be posted, and much as it might deserve it it has had little legal trouble.
FYI, 4chan tries to judge by style rather than stated age to determine loli. Only the most clearly lolicon (babies and some of that stuff drawn by Koume Keito) are actually banned. The rest is a "know it when you see it" semi-standard.
Posters who post loli pics in the images section will have them removed or be temp-banned. Loli content may only be linked to, with no samples.
Folks who lurv their lolis are already used to these kinds of measures, and by my estimation sites that use them to avoid legal issues have not had their content diversity undermined...much. The fact remains that there isn't an objective standard for cartoon loli outside of the obvious extremes. Use that to your advantage.
4chan doesn't allow CP (child porn) and obviously lolicon content to be posted, and much as it might deserve it it has had little legal trouble.
FYI, 4chan tries to judge by style rather than stated age to determine loli. Only the most clearly lolicon (babies and some of that stuff drawn by Koume Keito) are actually banned. The rest is a "know it when you see it" semi-standard.
Posters who post loli pics in the images section will have them removed or be temp-banned. Loli content may only be linked to, with no samples.
Folks who lurv their lolis are already used to these kinds of measures, and by my estimation sites that use them to avoid legal issues have not had their content diversity undermined...much. The fact remains that there isn't an objective standard for cartoon loli outside of the obvious extremes. Use that to your advantage.
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Man this is just getting burned up does it ? ok basicly anyone who is in this site must know about hentai somewhereelse first right ? doesn't matters wheter lolicon or not basicly wat i say is that if u can control and handle urself properly, it really doesn't matter how many porn stuff u read anyway.Am i right ?
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hmmm. just my 5 cents:
since i'm under 18 and all.. i'm into loli cause its in my age group. in singapore, females can LEGALLY have sex at the age of 16 (willing of course) BUT they can charge a male for having sex with them before their 18. so, its not whether its loli or not, bush-head is just trying to win more votes from PARENTS. i agree that child porn is offensive, but drawing it should not cause one to be fined, let alone jailed. as long as you are not breaking copyright issues, i dont really see the problem. look at it this way, there are HUNDREDS of child porn sites with tens coming up everyday. i dont think they'll go out of their way to crack down on fakku.
since i'm under 18 and all.. i'm into loli cause its in my age group. in singapore, females can LEGALLY have sex at the age of 16 (willing of course) BUT they can charge a male for having sex with them before their 18. so, its not whether its loli or not, bush-head is just trying to win more votes from PARENTS. i agree that child porn is offensive, but drawing it should not cause one to be fined, let alone jailed. as long as you are not breaking copyright issues, i dont really see the problem. look at it this way, there are HUNDREDS of child porn sites with tens coming up everyday. i dont think they'll go out of their way to crack down on fakku.
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Well, the "loli as gateway drug" thing does kinda sound like the whole "video games cause violence" argument. A couple pedophiles have loli hentai on their computers and that "proves" that there's a link between reading loli and going onto pedophilia. Whereas the counter-argument is that these people already have those tendencies, so of course that kinda thing would interest them, but it doesn't prove that everyone interested in them is necessarily a pedophile.
Legally it's still pretty muddled I guess. I know for a long time they wouldn't release the full version of "Kite" here in the US (due to the presence of sex scenes when the main character was obviously underage), but recently they did release it and now you can just go pick up a copy at your local FYE.
Legally it's still pretty muddled I guess. I know for a long time they wouldn't release the full version of "Kite" here in the US (due to the presence of sex scenes when the main character was obviously underage), but recently they did release it and now you can just go pick up a copy at your local FYE.
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Nikon wrote...
axe lottleWhile people are jumping to that conclusion, the biggest matter is the legality of the issue. I have no desire to see FAKKU go down the tubes for something that could have been prevented. I'm not saying other things should go untouched, as they're on the chopping block next... but we as a site get enough traffic daily that it's about time things like these be brought up.
I know that I'm supposed to be talking about the legality of the issue, I just tend to get a little unhappy when people start calling loli-lovers paedophiles in disguse, so I wanted to respond to that. Sorry if I shouldn't have.
But leaving that whole thing aside, I had heard that the PROTECT act only banned Lolicon images that were based on real people and/or occurences, so for example a pornographic picture of Chiyo-chan (from Azumanga Daioh) isn't illegal, but a drawn pornographic image of Emma Watson (Hermione from the Harry Potter movies) would be illegal. Never heard anything to that effect from somewhere other than not4chan, though, so my information may have been slightly biased.
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I was under the assumption that the law only applied to situations like axe lottle had mentioned. There is no victim in Lolicon as it isn't real... you can't PROTECT someone when there is no victim XD. However, i may be wrong, i haven't exactly read up on the law in a while. either way, i'm sure laws against it will jump back and forth because of the 1st amendment. i'm over joyed that our president is worried about drawings instead of other important issues <_<;.
Personally, i like Lolicon because it isn't real. However, i think that if Fakku wants to avoid legal issues, Lolicon should be limited(death to toddlercon!). That with a disclaimer about ages should help keep things safe.
though, it then goes to what people consider loli... i personally hate the whole "small boobies=loli!!11" train of thought. I don't get how a 1000+ year old character can be labeled as a loli XP. I think it comes down to the characters age... and unless the artist says "this character is *insert age*" you can't make much of an assumption on their age, but that's just me.
Personally, i like Lolicon because it isn't real. However, i think that if Fakku wants to avoid legal issues, Lolicon should be limited(death to toddlercon!). That with a disclaimer about ages should help keep things safe.
though, it then goes to what people consider loli... i personally hate the whole "small boobies=loli!!11" train of thought. I don't get how a 1000+ year old character can be labeled as a loli XP. I think it comes down to the characters age... and unless the artist says "this character is *insert age*" you can't make much of an assumption on their age, but that's just me.
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Worst scenario is that FAKKU will be closed down for a little while, emphasize on "little" in order to get rid of all the "offensive" images. Then it would go up with reduced content. I've seen it happen to HentaiPalm. I know I'm referring to it alot, lately, but they're pretty big and FAKKU will be approaching that level sooner or later.
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![[Greed] User Avatar](https://t.fakku.net/images/avatars/63703685045f4b340d37bc.jpg)
azumax wrote...
Worst scenario is that FAKKU will be closed down for a little while, emphasize on "little" in order to get rid of all the "offensive" images. Then it would go up with reduced content. .worst case scenario might be having a couple of FAKKU members being arrested just because they like/read lolicon. I also agree with KTP there are much more important issues then deciding if these comics are Illegal or not. I know Bush want to put the Republican party in good terms with parents because of the upcoming 2008 elections. How about he does somthing about the Immigration issue, or the rise in gas prices. How about the Iraq war??.. did we forget we have troops there? and what of the growing ecologcal issues? I want his to do SOMTHING good in the 8 years he has been in office.
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Just so everyone knows I have been staying out of this conversation so that I wouldn't influence the discussion. But everyone has been doing an awesome job contributing their opinions and I would like to thank each of you.
Obviously we can't say "If the girl in the manga is under 18, we can't host it." We all now that 90% of all female anime characters are between 14 - 17.
So what I am thinking will end up happening is, if in the actual manga (this only pertains to English ones) the character says something about their age being 11 or something, then we won't host it. And for Japanese ones we can be more lenient but obviously if the characters are blatantly lolicon material then I may step in.
BUT I don't think anyone has posted any solid laws against this or examples of sites getting shut down explicitly for this kind of stuff. So if anyone can do some research that will greatly affect the outcome.
Obviously we can't say "If the girl in the manga is under 18, we can't host it." We all now that 90% of all female anime characters are between 14 - 17.
So what I am thinking will end up happening is, if in the actual manga (this only pertains to English ones) the character says something about their age being 11 or something, then we won't host it. And for Japanese ones we can be more lenient but obviously if the characters are blatantly lolicon material then I may step in.
BUT I don't think anyone has posted any solid laws against this or examples of sites getting shut down explicitly for this kind of stuff. So if anyone can do some research that will greatly affect the outcome.
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Hi, I just read all of this regarding Loli. No offense but I think it's wrong.....Actually. I think it's wrong but I couldn't care less. xD! Isn't it just drawn porn? (Of course, if ya think about it, Loli videos should be illegal....otherwise, where else and how would you get those voices??) It disgusts me as much as yaoi, but I think it shouldn't be banned. Hell, I really don't care about either unless people are waving it in front of me and saying "YAOI YAOI YAOI YAOI YAOI YAOI!" or the other.
Which brings me to another point. If you aren't looking at it, why should you ban it? That brings another idea. If you're jackin off a loli cartoon or manga, what's to stop you from doing it in real life? Also, for those who say "It doesn't bother because it isn't real" .........Maybe you should start thinking about this, it is real because it's on a fricken piece of paper! xD!
But really, even if you think it isn't real, can't you still imagine it in your head?
Cartoons...hentai....usually anything animated, is something real (I'm not talking about fantasy here, talkin about what could actually be) but just colored and depicted in a cartoonish way. think about that a give me a reply. I'm kinda confused as to what I just wrote here. xD!
Which brings me to another point. If you aren't looking at it, why should you ban it? That brings another idea. If you're jackin off a loli cartoon or manga, what's to stop you from doing it in real life? Also, for those who say "It doesn't bother because it isn't real" .........Maybe you should start thinking about this, it is real because it's on a fricken piece of paper! xD!
But really, even if you think it isn't real, can't you still imagine it in your head?
Cartoons...hentai....usually anything animated, is something real (I'm not talking about fantasy here, talkin about what could actually be) but just colored and depicted in a cartoonish way. think about that a give me a reply. I'm kinda confused as to what I just wrote here. xD!
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Shyster wrote...
Which brings me to another point. If you aren't looking at it, why should you ban it? That brings another idea. If you're jackin off a loli cartoon or manga, what's to stop you from doing it in real life? Also, for those who say "It doesn't bother because it isn't real" .........Maybe you should start thinking about this, it is real because it's on a fricken piece of paper! xD! But really, even if you think it isn't real, can't you still imagine it in your head?
Cartoons...hentai....usually anything animated, is something real (I'm not talking about fantasy here, talkin about what could actually be) but just colored and depicted in a cartoonish way. think about that a give me a reply. I'm kinda confused as to what I just wrote here. xD!
If you're saying what I think you're saying, here's my argument:
It can't be illegal, because it's not real. Know why? Because in regular CP, a child was forced to get undressed or something to make the pictures. With real child porn, you have a victim: the child.
With loli, that's not the case. The art was made from someone's imagination. There's no victim.
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Shyster, I like to read Lolicon, but that don't mean i'm willing to go out and take it to real life... my sister has three kids, if anyone so much as looked at them wrong, uncle here would be the first to give them a Russian Necktie XD. It isn't real, there's no use in comparing it to CP. Same thing applies to the people i killed on GTA today, nothing but pixels on a screen. Lolicon is just ink/pencil on paper or pixels on your monitor(unless 3d rendered, but its still the same concept). If someone has a hard time telling that there is a difference between real life and something that isn't real, it's them that has a problem, not loli images.
Anyways, i like the idea of seeing if age is mentioned in the manga as well as looking for stuff that is obviously loli without a doubt. Since Fakku is hosted within the US, i suppose the best thing would be to just go by US age limit laws. Though, i don't know if manga would be considered commercial sex or not since Fakku isn't selling it XD
Anyways, i like the idea of seeing if age is mentioned in the manga as well as looking for stuff that is obviously loli without a doubt. Since Fakku is hosted within the US, i suppose the best thing would be to just go by US age limit laws. Though, i don't know if manga would be considered commercial sex or not since Fakku isn't selling it XD
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azumax wrote...
What makes a lolicon, well, lolicon?For all we know, we can include a read me saying all characters portrayed in the manga/doujin are over the age of 18.
And it will probably make a difference. I remember reading something in the HentaiPalm forums quite a while back regarding incestuous doujins. Most of his doujins got through Canadian check-up but his laptop was confiscated after a page which has "big brother" in it.
Anyways, my point is, it's these little things to makes so much difference >>
i remember when hentai palms american servers were sweeped for lolicon, they determined by boob size, which is just stupid...girls over 18 can have small boobies...only the artist can really and truly determine age...
yeah, america is a very conservative country, because of the strong role religion plays in the government...i plan to take a long vacation when i finish school to japan, the netherlands, and other parts of europe and asia, just to see the difference