Hypocrites?!

~Disclaimer~(I have nothing against anyone, what they believe in or prefer. I do support gay rights and equality)
i'm being very serious.

I don't understand a lot of people today especially activists, for instance people who REALLY support gay rights and stuff. Many times I see and hear them say that people should be able to live and do what they want without anyone telling them otherwise. Yet when someone says they're religious these same people start bad mouthing them for what they believe or because they believe in something to begin with.
I just think thats really hypocritical of us to say to be yourself and accept new things, but not accept everything.

~Please leave a serious response! I really feel strongly about this.~

People are hypocrites by nature i think its fucked up but thats the way we are

For what I know, hypocrisy is in everyone, but more so in those who had very hypocritical friends or family

It might be because the gay rights movement is a more popular and trending issue than general religious aspects.

But you're right. There's plenty of hypocrites out there that use principles that they only apply to what they want to apply them to.

All humans are biased, no matter how pious they may seem,

and hypocrisy stems from bias.

I, for one, fail to see the hypocrisy. Accepting homosexuality means accepting a natural part of sexuality. Accepting religion means accepting stupidity.

I think people are free to do whatever they feel like. If you feel like going to church, go right ahead. Just don't expect two particular things: one, don't expect to get away with making laws based on that religion and two, don't expect to be respected for saying you believe in it.

So, accepting religion doesn't mean holding hands and saying «I don't believe in Jesus but he sure seems like a nice fella». On that logic, it would be same as starting to watch gay porn as to accept homosexuality.

Bottom line: homosexuality is natural. Religion is the cause of a lot of crap. It doesn't deserve respect. The people who follow it deserve what everyone else does: tolerance. There's a huge difference between tolerance and respect.

I do agree that people are often hypocrites but not on this one.

QFT

Religion is a choice, homosexuality isn't. To boot, homosexuality hurts noone, while religion hurts many. I'm not saying "ban religion!" but at the same time bashing churches while advocating gay freedom isn't hypocritical in the slightest.

Ad hominem, please.



It's true that religion is very political, and it is true that homosexuality in it's own right is not, so that is comparing apples to oranges -- true.

However, this is not about gay people, it's about gay rights, which is purely a political construct.

So for a person to say that they wish to support/believe in a political construct(gay rights) without harassment and then to harass others who support/believe in a different particular political construct(religion) is hypocritical.
You are simply wrong.

It isn't because things have to be said. Religion hurts people and wants to spread its tentacles on free society. Pushing that back is a legitimate fight whereas banning gay people from having equal rights is simply not.

Defending gay rights and defending religion is NOT the same thing. They are NOT on equal grounds of legitimacy.



It most certainly is NOT an ad hominem. Do you even know what that expression means? I am attacking an ideology, not a person. And even attacking a person does not necessarily entail an ad hominem in case you don't know. If person X says stupid things, person Y has every right to call him stupid. It is not an ad hominem if it's true. Nor is it an ad hominem if no distinct person is involved.

Gay rights isn't a polical agenda, you moron. See? You said something stupid so I get to call you stupid. At least on this case. Gay rights are human rights. It is not a political agenda, it is an ethical one. No one can influence or attack a person's rights based on their sexuality which is what is being done.

You also make a filthy, disgusting false simile, don't you? The harrassment made by religious people is hate propaganda, attacks on human rights, retarding humanistic progress and, in some cases, violence. The harrassment made by the gay rights people is «Your pope is a pedophile».

By the Gods, saying gay rights is all about politics... Seriously, I don't even...

I did not once say gay rights is a "political agenda", but rather political construct. I know you don't know what it means, so I'll go ahead and give you the definition out of the dictionary. Construct: "an image, idea, or theory, especially a complex one formed from a number of simpler elements."

All rights are political constructs, whether it be human rights, economic rights, the freedom of religion, freedom to a fair trial, freedom from torture, etc. Rights exist as a cornerstone of modern society, existing within national and international law and as a keystone of any modern government.


Defining gay rights as human rights, since gay people are human is fine by me. However, advocating for gay rights while attacking the freedom of belief is the same as advocating one section of human rights and attacking another section of human rights at the same time. This is why it's hypocritical, you retard.

So it is only hypocritical on a technical level? Good for you, that's just great. Listen up, you unbelievable idiot: gay rights are human right. It has nothing to do with politics, it is ALL ABOUT ETHICS. How are you not getting this?

In fact, gay rights shouldn't even be called gay rights. They should pure and simply be called human rights, namely equality and freedom. Is equality and freedom all about politics or is it about, well, being human?

And listen up to the difference too. On one case, you are defending someone's rights, on the other you are holding up a 2000 year old book and preaching about Hell. They are not on equal ground. One is a natural occurrence in human sexuality the other is a belief system that has caused non stop evil and bigotry. Oh, and get this you moron. Making fun of a person's belief system is NOT THE SAME as attacking their right to believe in it. But it doesn't work that way on the other side of the house now, does it?

Ladies, ladies

The solution to being called ad hominen isn't to act ad hominen, or get as close to being that way as possible while still being able to say you aren't via technicality.

Now the other side of the coin

Saying religion is stupid isn't ad hominen. He quite literally means that religion isn't based upon intellectuality. That's a fact. If you think someone calling your religion stupid equals them calling you stupid, sorry, but that's your problem.

Advocating gay rights because they're rights while condemning the right to believe is hypocritical. However, I don't support gay rights because they're "rights" or because I support "freedom" or anything. I support it because it isn't harmful. On that note, my reason for looking down upon religion is because it is harmful. I'm applying the same method of observation to each. That's absolutely fair, and not hypocritical in the slightest. You can't say "my neighbor is allowed to play tennis, therefore I'm allowed to run people over because they're both rights". It's not about being allowed to do whatever you want, it's about what is hurtful and what isn't.

You're right actually, I'm sure we won't have buddist extremists swearing to force nirvana onto western civilization via airplanes. To boot, I'm yet to hear a buddist deny evolution, etc. I think the real reason why buddism is that way is because it's unpopular. Really, do you think any prideful gay bashers would rise up against the tide if christians only made up 10% of the US population? There are examples other than buddism and christianity though, but for now it'll be my example since I just finished up saint young men.

Now, as you pointed out, I guess I don't really dislike religion as a whole. Either way, it isn't a matter of "I have freedom," it's a matter of "I'm not hurting anything". I don't care what people think they were born with the right to do, if it's screwing with peoples shit, it's probably not good, and while homosexuality does that in the literal sense, religion does it allot more in the figurative sense.

Finally, someone who gets it. I don't know who spread this diseased idea that ad hominem is the worst thing in the world. It is perfectly acceptable to insult X should X fall under the category of such insult. If religion is stupid, why is it wrong to say it is stupid?

I don't see anyone condeming the right to believe either. What kind of paradox is that? A religious persecution in name of «not religion» with the goal to end religion? That doesn't seem to be the case. It's called free society for a reason. When it comes to religious belief, no one questions the right to, they question the how as in «how can they believe that?» or «how messed up are they to think they can affect my life as they see fit?». This discussion is a few steps away of the LGBT community being accused of wanting to apply thoughtcrime laws which is pathetic.

Not sure what you mean by «cool» but if things are X, then calling them X is not wrong, it is a statement of fact. If apples are indeed red, in other words, they have the attribute of redness, then it is correct to call them red. If John Doe is indeed stupid, in other words, he has the attribute of stupidity, why is it wrong to say he's stupid?

The only objection would be because it wouldn't accomplish anything. In that sense, I might agree. I don't go around telling people random things I think about them. But that doesn't happen with religion, now does it? Religion is a much different thing. Explaining why would be a different point.

And well, you are probably right. «Religion is stupid» (I know you said «being» but I think the slight change makes no difference, let me know if you disagree) is an opinion. However, like, let's see, any other opinion in the world, it can be correct or incorrect. Let's look at religion and see if we find stupid things about it. If we do, the statement is correct and apples are red.