Since I can't sleep, might as well...
WideEyedMan wrote...
mibuchiha wrote...
if the only other option is to have a mediocre mind that could call this sort of banality good.
I don't believe my joke warranted this kind of response(if it wasn't clear what my serious response was simply look a line down). If it was offensive to you then I apologize for that but I think it's wrong to call everyone that enjoys Fate idiotic just from my mistake.
Not all but a good portion of them, yes. Fate/Stay Night is nowhere near stellar as people tout it to be. Enjoyable, yes. Anything more? Errmm nope.
mibuchiha wrote...
The characterization is poor, in particular the masters (let's not even touch the side characters, why do they even exist hell if I know).
Those that Nasu actually invented are crap. Except Archer. He's alright.
True. Many students like Rydou Issei, the track club, archery club president(I can't even remember some of their names) and many others were there to set the mood for a school setting and I doubt derailing the story is even worth them.
I disagree with the notion that everything Nasu made is crap, Illya for example. Illya constantly tortured Shirou because of her resentment towards her father abandoning her to raise Shirou but at the same time she relents and even accepts him in HF because she sympathized with him being a person Kiritsugu dragged into his life then left behind and she was going to live her short life fulfilling a petty revenge against one of the people who actually cared for her. The fact that she physically spited Emiya but sometimes refused to actually kill him showed her childish nature in lashing out at something remotely related to her past trauma but showing hesitation in commitment to the act. Her later acceptance of Shirou is a result of her rapid maturity from growing up without her father, being under the harsh care of the Einzberns and gradually learning that Shirou doesn't deserve what Illya is doing to him. Now an example of fairly poor characterization would be Souchiro Kuzuki, he did have a few good scenes when he died but most of the time he was an dry piece of wood that literally had no reason to stay with Caster. I suppose his lifelessness was for contrast to how Jason treated Medea but he's still a poor character. Saying that everything Nasu made character wise was trash is too radical of a statement, he's done good work with some of them and others are terrible. You've even said that Archer is okay but I think there's more than just Archer.
Ah Ilya. Forgot about her. She's ok too. And might be some else I missed but whatever lol. Kuzuki is among the bad ones, or maybe the author is just lazy.
Shirou. Oh god. No plans to talk about his issues for now, hopefully those are already clear. But he's not even consistent. Ok, different routes means different settings, but Nasu could do better to trick me than suddenly going "Oh I've loved her all along" in HF when he showed not the slightest sign of noticing Sakura prior. And the whole crap about him growing up from idealistic in Fate and mature in HF... through what exactly? Different routes are supposed to be alternate universes, you can't magically transfer memories and call that character development smh.
Rin. You tried hard Nasu to make her look talented, but until this day I see none of it. She has no resolve, clumsy, why the fuck tropes like tsundere exists in a story about war anyway... I fail to see her as nothing more than an elaborate and convoluted approach to fanservice. Like Strike Witches.
I love comparing FSN and FZ as they are very close together. Now see, Nasu glorified servants as this inhumane being that totally tops everything. Yet more than once he pulled shit like having nubs defeat them. Ten years ago... "Wait, Maiya. It's Assassin we're dealing with. We're not equipped to fight servants," said an experienced murderer. Later, some scrub who did no shit suddenly defeated the most broken (but dumbed down to ridiculous levels, thanks to your author truly) servant out there. Count me unconvinced. Guy don't know to stick to the very system he invented. Smh.
mibuchiha wrote...
And for a story with such a rich backdrop (summoning real heroes to fight your war?) this made poor use of that.
It would help if you told me when and how the rich back drop was wasted.
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Again, FZ. The whole thing is solemn throughout. Even in relatively lighthearted parts, like Rider chugging beer, some key points of his heroism could be seen. And in all cases the servants basically are the heroes as they are, living the legend. Gil could indeed in FZ be seen as the primordial king. Lancelot the fallen knight. Rider and his eternal conquest. Lancer with his sad tales. Ok, not perfectly of course, but the background story in integrated much more seamlessly here. Needless to say, my favorite is the epic Gil vs Rider battle, where almost every damn line and move is a shoutout to the lores.
In FSN, name me a hero who actually had anything traceable back to the lore? Saber nope, she's just that pretty girl pampered by and sighing because of Shirou. Caster, mmm ok in the church scene. Rider, what lore? Ditto Berserker. He could be Incredible Hulk and it makes no difference to the plot. Gil? In FSN he's but a horny retard. Lancer, one sees much in his personality and some lines, but no key points. Assassin has little screentime to work with. Archer had none so ok.
And there's this crap about school life Fuji-nee date at Shinto and what the fuck else. Shinji too. Eugh. How saddening when some other guy takes your universe and write something vastly superior than you did. If that's not Nasu being a mediocre author, then I don't know what to call him. Hell, his later Fates got crappier, not better.
Writing in iPad is kinda tough lol.