Forgiving the devil...

I think the whole point of devil like figures in religion is that they wont repent. In Christianity, the devil was a fallen angle stripped of his wings and title and thrown out of heaven.

It depends how you define 'good' and 'evil'.

If you look at the kill count, Satan kills about 10 people in the bible, whereas god kills over 2 million (actual figures vary with the source) and almost every animal on the planet at one point, using methods like floods, plagues and turning men into salt. Many justify god's rampant bloodlust by saying those he killed were 'sinners' or 'infidel'. Others ignore it.

However, based on the fact that the devil is supposed to torture souls for all eternity, some would see that as more 'evil'. But then those who go to hell are bad people anyway, so isn't he just giving them what they deserve?

To be honest, to me, god sound more evil. I mean, Satan just rebelled against him, and rather than attempting peaceful negotiations, god just throws him into a lake of fire. Hardly what the image of an omnibenevolent god would do.

I would be less likely to forgive god, because he expects forgiveness.

Well that kind of turned into a rant about christianity, but what of other religions? Are there gods as bad as their devils? I don't know, but it would be interesting to hear about.

I would forgive him, I don't see any reason why I shouldn't forgive him and if I could really tell he was repenting (Ignoring the subjective idea that we can't tell what someone is truly feeling) then I would certainly forgive him. Perhaps I would punish him through a justice system for what he's done since I don't think simple repenting would be enough to get off without a punishment.

In standard Christian theologies (Catholic, and mainline Protestant) the answer is usually as follows:

Because the Devil was an ascended being who knew God as He is and still chose to oppose Him there is no redemption for him. He both would not repent and would not be forgiven if he did. For lack of a better term he is a 'perfect' (or perhaps better said 'static') being, he is what he is and not subject to change of ideas or character or personal growth like mortals (and in some theologies God Himself) are.

He's not like a human that makes mistakes. When he does evil he dies it with intent, malice, and deliberation, with full understanding of the consequences. A human that had all of those traits would not be forgivable in some theologies either, but humans are finite and rarely fully understand the consequences of any of their actions in full. They also normally lack some of the other traits.

Here we go again :)

I've just discovered Hataraku Maou-sama. Maybe some of you know it as light novel or manga or anime or whatelse. I find interesting that quite a number of mangas and such (Bastard!!, etc) interrogate the manichean cleavage of Good and Evil from the religions of the Book(s?) in more than a way.



To relate to this present thread, lot of these mangas ask the very same question as I do :

There seem to be various answers and points of view in mangas. Personally, I tend to like those :
- forgiving the (more or less) repenting devil
- forgiving an ex-devil (= only its past is devilish)
- forgiving a devil just doing his/her job (= as being the devil) and not overdoing it
- turning a devil in a new leaf by means such as love, friendship, etc
and I tend to dislike those :
- unfair toward even the devil
- seeking revenge rather than "justice"
- confusing Revenge and Justice
- not able to evolve -- mainly : freezed mindset, unable-to-forgive mindset, resentful mindset, to-dumb-to-change behavior, etc


What about you guys and girls ?

IMHO, it's not a matter of forgiveness, but of necessity.

The devil/Serpent/Lucifer of Christianity and any other evil figure in any religion exist as warnings for the faithful - don't stray from the path laid down by the teachings of your god, lest you sin and forfeit your place among the righteous.

They also exist as examples, to show that whatever god banished them and keeps them at bay is almighty and will always triumph over evil.

Of course, that's my interpretation, and as I said multiple times, I ain't religious.

God created and tested the humanities that'll gospel with mankind. Hell would change it's trust, they are not inversely of heaven but the obliterator in the afterlife which we frown. And if we not trusted god but play good then the catholic society believes we'll be within the future of hell, that is the flaw of concept. And those features that we hate turns into the good-evil. The ones who judge what would be good or evil were the religious societies, now we have an already settled religion. Which I remark their belief, since God wanted trust it's assume that we have trust because of practitioners. But christianity has not touched good and evil as much as doing good things through the new testament-Jesus.

It's not the necessary will or that justifying God,

God 'Why'd u do dis to me?'

Men 'U killed innocentpeeple!'

Gawd 'Deh meanss to an end'

Men 'You sterted a massacree!'

Gord 'I courrss the revoruutitoon!'

Men 'You BETRAY THE GOOOODRD!!

Godd 'GOOOOOARRRRRRD!!!'

Would I forgive the Devil?
Lucifer- The Dawn-star the one who stood closest to god
Would he repent, I think the question is moot
Why would you ask the most perfect of your first children
To bow before their lesser, weaker, shorter lived counterparts
the children of Adam, the cursed ones, the second children.

I feel that the Devil has nothing to forgive, he is what he was created to be
I curse him no more than a bird that flies, Or a wolf that howls, or a deer that forages.
The Devil is the Devil because that's what he was made to be.
The balance for a fickle god.
For that reason the Devil has nothing to repent, and I have nothing to forgive him for.
Man is the one who should not be forgiven.
For what in nature isn't perfect by its own right.
And what has man ever created that is.

Oooh, abit late to the party,
But, if the devil is aligned to my interests, then there is no need to forgive him is there?
I.e. If I also wanted to send everyone to hell, wouldn't the devil be my best friend?

The definition of right and wrong and forgivable and non-forgivable is not for us, nor anyone to decide, in my opinion.
The devil can carry on thinking he is right, and God will also punish the devil for defiling his laws. In this case, because God holds more power, a case of 'victor sets the rules' come into play.
My main point is that if the devil had more power over God, raping your next door neighbour might be the right thing to do in that universe, and likewise helping someone in need can be consider a sin punishable by death.

Good only exists through the juxtoposition of evil, peace comes only after strife. As the devil is largely a symbolic source of all human evil, he is also an entirely necessary part of what it means to human. Without evil, we wouldn't really be what we are. We'd lose something essential. And I don't just mean "evil" acts, I mean thoughts and desires etc too. So yeah, rather than forgive maybe understand is what we should aim for, because that's what truly mends things. It isn't about condemning or forgiving.
Not saying we should let crime go unpunished or anything of course. I just mean that the devil as the sum of all evil isn't really a question of forgive or condemn.

(agnostic)

The whole concept of the Christian devil is a contradition to the whole religion. The religion is based on forgivness and "turning the other cheek", so why would there exist a being of no forgivness?

Because god works in mysterious ways.

That is legitimately the most Christian argument possible.