Israel + Palestine = WTF!?
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Okay I'm an atheist and looking at these damn wars they constantly seem to have and I'm pissed at how my nation (USA) is actually even supporting either of them. Frankly I must say that we're actually trying to win a damn religious war! These people have been fighting for countless years, and you just know that they won't stop. Even if one of these surrounding nations invade Israel successfully, then Israel will make a counter invasion, even if they have to gather all the Jews and Christians in the world in order to push Palestine back.
For those of you who are indeed religious you might know what I'm talking about. Just how far would you go to protect what you see as your sacred culture? While I'm at it I'm going to add that it's a nuisance that we must try to help and supply a nation willing to spend infinite resources on its independence and for you avid readers of the Art of War you should also know that no nation has ever benefited from prolonged warfare.
If anybody can explain to me what the hell is going on up in the upper echelons then please feel free to do so, because I find this constant conflict absolutely useless and even more so illogical.
For those of you who are indeed religious you might know what I'm talking about. Just how far would you go to protect what you see as your sacred culture? While I'm at it I'm going to add that it's a nuisance that we must try to help and supply a nation willing to spend infinite resources on its independence and for you avid readers of the Art of War you should also know that no nation has ever benefited from prolonged warfare.
If anybody can explain to me what the hell is going on up in the upper echelons then please feel free to do so, because I find this constant conflict absolutely useless and even more so illogical.
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So far, since 1947, Israel has done a fine job of defeating Eqypt, Syria, and any Arab country that attacked them. If Moshe Dyan was still alive, he would greatfully explain all of Israel's victories. Especially with little to no help from anyone.
If anyone infringed on my inalienable rights to ecchi and any other enjoyment of my life. There will be hell and more suffering they will face.
If anyone infringed on my inalienable rights to ecchi and any other enjoyment of my life. There will be hell and more suffering they will face.
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loosehead99 wrote...
So far, since 1947, Israel has done a fine job of defeating Eqypt, Syria, and any Arab country that attacked them. If Moshe Dyan was still alive, he would greatfully explain all of Israel's victories. Especially with little to no help from anyone.If anyone infringed on my inalienable rights to ecchi and any other enjoyment of my life. There will be hell and more suffering they will face.
Yes they have done an astounding job, however I still must question why would we endorse such things as a war driven by religion? Was nothing learned from the crusades?
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mibuchiha
Fakku Elder
goonsquad wrote...
Yes they have done an astounding job, however I still must question why would we endorse such things as a war driven by religion? Was nothing learned from the crusades?1) Because those politicians seriously believe it's important, and this is unlikely.
2) Because they need the votes, and a lot of people are religious.
Either way, I know I want nuke despite knowing it's wrong. Arabs are just... meh.
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loosehead99 wrote...
So far, since 1947, Israel has done a fine job of defeating Eqypt, Syria, and any Arab country that attacked them. If Moshe Dyan was still alive, he would greatfully explain all of Israel's victories. Especially with little to no help from anyone.If anyone infringed on my inalienable rights to ecchi and any other enjoyment of my life. There will be hell and more suffering they will face.
with emphasis on "little to no help from anyone."
Israel is america's answer to democracy in southwest asia [middle east]; as a result, we like to throw money at them
edit: realizing i have contributed nothing to this thread aside a googled image of united states foreign aid to israel, i suppose i should make a point to state the obvious:
palestinians currently live in the most densely populated shanty-town israel could make for them, but hey, it was the israelites land in the first place, amirite?
also, it is not my intention to troll, but sitting through a week on this topic ~3 years ago [go high school!] gave me enough knowledge on the subject to spew this post out, fox only, no items, final destination.
^^lack of experience posting intellectually on the internet
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Just how far would you go to protect what you see as your sacred culture?
Ask yourself the same question. What if someone took the most important thing in your life and stomped all over it? What if someone took _everything_ in your life and stomped all over it? How far will you go to defend it? It deoesn't have to be religion, it can be anything.
"Give me freedom or give me death" ring a bell? One of the reasons why america was founded was because of religious persecution.
Also, the war in the middle is is as much about land as it is about religion. You have two groups of people who want to occupy the same piece of land. That's practically 90% of all wars fought right there.
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Yes they have done an astounding job, however I still must question why would we endorse such things as a war driven by religion? Was nothing learned from the crusades?[/quote]
Take religion out of your equation. What does the Muslims have left to live for?
Do you know the history of how the Middle East became Muslim?
How did the US begin? Religious persecution and capitalism.
How different is Isreali ancestry to the Palastinean ancestry?
Is it really religion causing these wars or is it a battle for racial (tribal) superiority?
Do you know who the Canaanites are?
The war for this land goes on for centuries before Muslims were around.
Are Yahweh and Allah the same God? If yes, why is it a religious war?
Did the 13 tribes of Israel decide to take this land from the Canaanites and other tribes for capitalism, religion or sheer visciousness?
I have no idea if religion is the main cause or a smoke screen for inter/intra tribal squabble.
I can go on but I do not want to create a wall.
I prefer the US go back to being an isolationist country. Let other countries run their own lives.
Take religion out of your equation. What does the Muslims have left to live for?
Do you know the history of how the Middle East became Muslim?
How did the US begin? Religious persecution and capitalism.
How different is Isreali ancestry to the Palastinean ancestry?
Is it really religion causing these wars or is it a battle for racial (tribal) superiority?
Do you know who the Canaanites are?
The war for this land goes on for centuries before Muslims were around.
Are Yahweh and Allah the same God? If yes, why is it a religious war?
Did the 13 tribes of Israel decide to take this land from the Canaanites and other tribes for capitalism, religion or sheer visciousness?
I have no idea if religion is the main cause or a smoke screen for inter/intra tribal squabble.
I can go on but I do not want to create a wall.
I prefer the US go back to being an isolationist country. Let other countries run their own lives.
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Bill Bagel wrote...
palestinians currently live in the most densely populated shanty-town israel could make for them, but hey, it was the israelites land in the first place, amirite?
My friend, it is because of this reason that all the major monotheistic religions are pissed off (Islam in particular). Israel by right belongs to every group of religion because they share the same history: The Abrahamic religion. In addition, every religion has an ancient edifice that withstood the test of time. For example, The Wall of The Temple of Solomon for the Jews, The Holy Sepulcher Church for the Christians and Al-Aqsa Mosque and the Dome of Rock for the Muslims. Hence this leads me to believe, the state in control over Israel will the gain an upper hand that can be compared to holding a knife right under your throat. This is because they can keep on threatening and bully the other two religions that they will crush or defile their ancient places of worship.
Also, why do you think the Palestinians live in a shanty town? Its obvious that their homes are bombed almost at a daily basis and they are chased out of their homes all the time. While you are sitting behind your computer, think again that there are others out there suffering 24/7 without even a moment to take a glimpse of intellectual discourse to change their lives.
loosehead99 wrote...
I can go on but I do not want to create a wall.
I prefer the US go back to being an isolationist country. Let other countries run their own lives.
The use of religion to justify this war I believe in my perspective is to fulfill the Jewish prophecy which is rather symbolic in nature. The Jews believe that erecting a wall is supposed to keep them away from the rest of other civilizations which WILL be at a constant state of war.In fact, Albert Einstein himself once said, " I do NOT know how World War 3 will be fought, but I know World War 4 will be fought with stick and stones."
Also, it has something to do with the the formation of Pax Judaica: The Rule of the Jews for a Thousand years. Hence, it is politically motivated through the use of religion. Then again, you can't separate religion from politics. Happens all around us. This is why Communism back then oppresses those who profess a religion to suppress theological thoughts to inspire the masses. Example, the Cultural Revolution in China.
I can't answer most of anyone's questions because I'm so knocked out with my research work at the moment....Only 2 months left to suffer....
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Damn, I actually trolled hard this time... -_-
Well anyways again like I said why would we support any of these religiously driven nations? Aren't we a nation that believes in separation of church and state?
Well anyways again like I said why would we support any of these religiously driven nations? Aren't we a nation that believes in separation of church and state?
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goonsquad wrote...
Damn, I actually trolled hard this time... -_-Well anyways again like I said why would we support any of these religiously driven nations? Aren't we a nation that believes in separation of church and state?
I believe it would be unwise to break ties that have been forged a long time ago. That's the problem with politics, there's too much convoluted BS that goes along with it.
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Does God really want to all his people dying just to cling to their religion. If god really exists, he will not let people to fight each other.
I pity the children who grew up in a war torn land. They can either grow up become another soldier or died. They can't even have a good life.
Why can those two religion live peacefully?
I pity the children who grew up in a war torn land. They can either grow up become another soldier or died. They can't even have a good life.
Why can those two religion live peacefully?
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Ieryuuda wrote...
Does God really want to all his people dying just to cling to their religion. If god really exists, he will not let people to fight each other.I pity the children who grew up in a war torn land. They can either grow up become another soldier or died. They can't even have a good life.
Why can those two religion live peacefully?
agree
i think the most peaceful way to solve this is the israel stop the advancing to palestine and the never ever bring out the conversation about land any more.
then the people of the plastine country should stop the gerilla attack towards the israel country.
simple
one have to step back and the other respect that decision and also follow the same.
if the reason was that mosque then i think it should be destroy for it was the cause of everything that happening right now.
even god if it' real that is he also will tell them to destroy it for it was the cause of all evil that happening right now.
well that's my idea.
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Israel is our only major ally in the middle east, so we need to back them in their wars. Plus, I dont think Israel has lost any of those wars yet.
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Captain Badass wrote...
Israel is our only major ally in the middle east, so we need to back them in their wars. Plus, I dont think Israel has lost any of those wars yet.that was one of the reason this war happen for so long for isreal never want to back down even once. is honor and dignity to important that they would like to kill their people for the sake of one greedy self?
yes isreal maybe your only ally in the middle east, why's that cause you kept telling people that this country was bad that country was bad, that what makes people hate you. they hate when you telling others something that they don't do at all that why you have no ally there.
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Qrast wrote...
i think the most peaceful way to solve this is the israel stop the advancing to palestine and the never ever bring out the conversation about land any more.
then the people of the plastine country should stop the gerilla attack towards the israel country.
No, that won't work.
Hamas' manifesto does not recognize the state of Israel.
In other words, even if Israel stopped attacking and suddenly went kumbaya, Hamas would still try to exterminate every Israli.
if the reason was that mosque then i think it should be destroy for it was the cause of everything that happening right now.
If you're talking about the Dome of the Rock, destroying it is a recipe for the end of the world in a nuclear holocaust. Congrats, you just broke the planet.
Well anyways again like I said why would we support any of these religiously driven nations? Aren't we a nation that believes in separation of church and state?
Because it isn't just about religion.
Israel is the only democracy in the area and was an ally against the soviet union.
If the US decides to say "fuck this shit", the US just lost any sort of moral high ground with regards to "freedom and democracry" and all that fun stuff. Seriously, abandoning an ally is a shitty thing to do.
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Kaimax
Best Master-San
fatman wrote...
Qrast wrote...
if the reason was that mosque then i think it should be destroy for it was the cause of everything that happening right now.
If you're talking about the Dome of the Rock, destroying it is a recipe for the end of the world in a nuclear holocaust. Congrats, you just broke the planet.
Seriously NO, If Israel decided to destroy Al Aqsa, it won't be a Palestine VS Israel anymore, it will be the whole Islam World Vs Israel, hence it will be the next World War 3.
Al Aqsa is just too precious for the Islamic community, it's one of the first mosque to be ever build in the world.
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Kaimax wrote...
fatman wrote...
Qrast wrote...
if the reason was that mosque then i think it should be destroy for it was the cause of everything that happening right now.
If you're talking about the Dome of the Rock, destroying it is a recipe for the end of the world in a nuclear holocaust. Congrats, you just broke the planet.
Seriously NO, If Israel decided to destroy Al Aqsa, it won't be a Palestine VS Israel anymore, it will be the whole Islam World Vs Israel, hence it will be the next World War 3.
Al Aqsa is just too precious for the Islamic community, it's one of the first mosque to be ever build in the world.
then for the sake of man kind the people of in charge there should the on to do it.
they (hamas) will destroy it with honor but in this history making the israel must not interfere at all cost. this will be the turning point of a new page on history
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Kaimax
Best Master-San
Qrast wrote...
then for the sake of man kind the people of in charge there should the on to do it.they (hamas) will destroy it with honor but in this history making the israel must not interfere at all cost. this will be the turning point of a new page on history
Hamas is already Pro extreme Islam, why should they want to destroy one of their most Holiest spots for Islam.
You talk so~~~ easy about honor yet, you simply didn't include the importance of "religions" in your equation.
this mind set of Middle East Islam has already been there since the dark ages, if you want to destroy the Al-Aqsa, you need to destroy All Muslims first.
Read it to understand why we can't just destroy and "build a new one" in the name of Al Aqsa
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Aqsa_Mosque
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Kaimax wrote...
Qrast wrote...
then for the sake of man kind the people of in charge there should the on to do it.they (hamas) will destroy it with honor but in this history making the israel must not interfere at all cost. this will be the turning point of a new page on history
Hamas is already Pro extreme Islam, why should they want to destroy one of their most Holiest spots for Islam.
You talk so~~~ easy about honor yet, you simply didn't include the importance of "religions" in your equation.
this mind set of Middle East Islam has already been there since the dark ages, if you want to destroy the Al-Aqsa, you need to destroy All Muslims first.
Read it to understand why we can't just destroy and "build a new one" in the name of Al Aqsa
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Aqsa_Mosque
yes! that's true but some one have to do something. forgive me if i say this the wrong way but do the muslim god and people really cherish the monument that they forsake their follower life!
i don't know why but i have a feeling that saint muhammad will agree with me if the cause of these evil should be destroy. even the god in the muslim religion forbid them to kill each other and 'apriciate' what they have but if that thing has only bring trouble than it is better to abandon it and started a new.
isn't that right?
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Kaimax
Best Master-San
Qrast wrote...
yes! that's true but some one have to do something. forgive me if i say this the wrong way but do the muslim god and people really cherish the monument that they forsake their follower life!
i don't know why but i have a feeling that saint muhammad will agree with me if the cause of these evil should be destroy. even the god in the muslim religion forbid them to kill each other and 'apriciate' what they have but if that thing has only bring trouble than it is better to abandon it and started a new.
isn't that right?
Your subjective perspective has symbolized the Mosque as an evil "war starter".
While Muslims subjective perspective, symbolized it as one of the holiest lands, and it was "stolen" by the Israel and they want it back in one piece.
the Israels symbolize it as a "obstacle" for them to get they're "land" back.
that's why I can't agree with you, since you only see it as an evil entity that honestly "didn't do any evil" before the Israel "took it by force".
and don't start assuming the Prophet things that won't even happen.