[Locked] The reason I'm not an athiest.
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Arizth wrote...
I always saw it kind of like this, on the big bang matter question:It's the leftovers from the last Universe that collapsed in it's own big crunch. I always saw that the universe was in a sort of loop, where it blows up, exists for a bit, collapses, and repeats.
Doesn't really explain anything, but it's fun to think about.
There are many theories for the big bang. As quantum physics is on the brink of proving itself my favorite theory is as follows.
The Big bang happens when two fabrics of different dimensions collide with each other and cause a "big bang" to occur. Apparently big bangs happen all the time and the space between the two dimensions is called a hyperspace, where all the created universes are in a bigger "multiuniverse". Even though this theory is far fetched to the simple minded it is not as absurd as it first seems.
Since the age of our universe is measured by how far we can trace light, it has been determined as around 13 billion years old. But looking upon the universe, scientists have found the universe to be flat. That is defiantly not possible, therefore the universe cant be 13 billion years old? The universe is quite possibly much MUCH bigger then we first imagined. Since because of the limit of light speed us humans can only see the universe as it is 13 billions years old. Therefore possibly a "multi universe" sized universe exists. We just cant see that far because the light hasn't had the time to travel to us.
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Arizth wrote...
I always saw it kind of like this, on the big bang matter question:
It's the leftovers from the last Universe that collapsed in it's own big crunch. I always saw that the universe was in a sort of loop, where it blows up, exists for a bit, collapses, and repeats.
Doesn't really explain anything, but it's fun to think about.
It is a possibility but, all it does is answer one question while creating another.
I really like the idea of a big crunch/bang but, I like the theory of (paraphrased) stars collapsing which turn into black holes and they eventually swallow up all matter in the universe which leads to the creation of a new universe where chemistry and physics don't work in the same way as they do here. I'm not sure of the name of that particular theory at the moment
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No matter what, Humans shall always fight. Humans don't go to war over religion or philosophies. Resources, population pressure, to improve the economy, space, personal protection, and, of course, fear of what the other can do.
Religion, philosophy, etc, are just excuses to make it easier to swallow. If there was an athiest society it'd still go to war just as often as it's counterpart. By the way, I'm an athiest.
Extremism is a bad thing. Always has been. Don't aim for the scapegoat, it never helps anything.
Religion, philosophy, etc, are just excuses to make it easier to swallow. If there was an athiest society it'd still go to war just as often as it's counterpart. By the way, I'm an athiest.
Extremism is a bad thing. Always has been. Don't aim for the scapegoat, it never helps anything.
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Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
Arizth wrote...
I always saw it kind of like this, on the big bang matter question:
It's the leftovers from the last Universe that collapsed in it's own big crunch. I always saw that the universe was in a sort of loop, where it blows up, exists for a bit, collapses, and repeats.
Doesn't really explain anything, but it's fun to think about.
It is a possibility but, all it does is answer one question while creating another.
I really like the idea of a big crunch/bang but, I like the theory of (paraphrased) stars collapsing which turn into black holes and they eventually swallow up all matter in the universe which leads to the creation of a new universe where chemistry and physics don't work in the same way as they do here. I'm not sure of the name of that particular theory at the moment
Hmm. I blame this on being small-minded, but I can't for the life of me imagine a universe where physics and chemistry are different from our own.
Maybe I've watched too much fantasy anime, but apart from examples like Slayers or Fullmetal Alchemist, I'm drawing a blank.
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I am a Atheist. And i grounded my believe of all what i have learned and experiences. Science have made the society we have today. And of curse it is hard to tell how all start because we don't where there. But i wont join some group because they have the answer to everything by blaming one guy. Maybe it was the big bang ore some other stuff. Maybe there are a god but i haven't seen any god proof of any existence. And if there where some kinda God, so do i believe that he is the most sadism person in the universe. Making all this life and watching it destroy them self. Sound like a funny job
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Arizth wrote...
Hmm. I blame this on being small-minded, but I can't for the life of me imagine a universe where physics and chemistry are different from our own.You are trying to apply current reality to a possible one. Under that theory I mentioned, I assume the basic elements would be different. Their atomic structures would be changed, molecules would behave differently from what we expect. Water may not even be a possibility as the chemical reaction would not even be possible.
It is only a theory though but, an intriguing one to say the least.
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Pocru wrote...
The reason I'm not an atheist is because it had to start SOMEWHERE.
I completely agree...
Being a Biology major, the evidence supporting evolution is so overwhelming that every time people try to deny its existence i literally have to leave the room.
That being said, i am not sure how life on earth began, there are many theories including seeded life, big bang, creationism, etc. but i just cant declare my support for one until, well, there is more support!
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Novocaine wrote...
Pocru wrote...
The reason I'm not an atheist is because it had to start SOMEWHERE.
I completely agree...
Being a Biology major, the evidence supporting evolution is so overwhelming that every time people try to deny its existence i literally have to leave the room.
That being said, i am not sure how life on earth began, there are many theories including seeded life, big bang, creationism, etc. but i just cant declare my support for one until, well, there is more support!
You can believe in evolution and a religion too, I actually know a lot of people like that.
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razama wrote...
Novocaine wrote...
Pocru wrote...
The reason I'm not an atheist is because it had to start SOMEWHERE.
I completely agree...
Being a Biology major, the evidence supporting evolution is so overwhelming that every time people try to deny its existence i literally have to leave the room.
That being said, i am not sure how life on earth began, there are many theories including seeded life, big bang, creationism, etc. but i just cant declare my support for one until, well, there is more support!
You can believe in evolution and a religion too, I actually know a lot of people like that.
Agreed. Unless your church is particularly conservative like the remnants of the Pilgrim Holiness churches. My mother goes to one, it might single-handidly be why I hate organized religion so much. Churches that align themselves with The Conservative Holiness Movement are an insult to normal Christians. -_-
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Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
Arizth wrote...
Hmm. I blame this on being small-minded, but I can't for the life of me imagine a universe where physics and chemistry are different from our own.You are trying to apply current reality to a possible one. Under that theory I mentioned, I assume the basic elements would be different. Their atomic structures would be changed, molecules would behave differently from what we expect. Water may not even be a possibility as the chemical reaction would not even be possible.
It is only a theory though but, an intriguing one to say the least.
Hmm...
So, theoretically, a universe akin to an existence we commonly see in Media, say High Fantasy, is possible so long as the proper accidents happen during creation?
For instance, to go with High Fantasy, the evolution of beings capable or controlling latent energy flows scattered throughout their version of nature?
Hell, I'm getting annoyed just imagining it. It makes our universe so droll by comparison.
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Arizth wrote...
Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
Arizth wrote...
Hmm. I blame this on being small-minded, but I can't for the life of me imagine a universe where physics and chemistry are different from our own.You are trying to apply current reality to a possible one. Under that theory I mentioned, I assume the basic elements would be different. Their atomic structures would be changed, molecules would behave differently from what we expect. Water may not even be a possibility as the chemical reaction would not even be possible.
It is only a theory though but, an intriguing one to say the least.
Hmm...
So, theoretically, a universe akin to an existence we commonly see in Media, say High Fantasy, is possible so long as the proper accidents happen during creation?
For instance, to go with High Fantasy, the evolution of beings capable or controlling latent energy flows scattered throughout their version of nature?
Hell, I'm getting annoyed just imagining it. It makes our universe so droll by comparison.
Theoretically, yes. Though the probability of carbon based lifeforms such as ourselves coming into existence is highly unlikely. We need water and in this "new" universe water may not even be physically possible to make as the structures and characteristics of the atoms themselves are changed. This extends to ALL elements in the universe.
The theory rests somewhere between the Big Bounce and a Multi-verse theory.
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Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
Arizth wrote...
Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
Arizth wrote...
Hmm. I blame this on being small-minded, but I can't for the life of me imagine a universe where physics and chemistry are different from our own.You are trying to apply current reality to a possible one. Under that theory I mentioned, I assume the basic elements would be different. Their atomic structures would be changed, molecules would behave differently from what we expect. Water may not even be a possibility as the chemical reaction would not even be possible.
It is only a theory though but, an intriguing one to say the least.
Hmm...
So, theoretically, a universe akin to an existence we commonly see in Media, say High Fantasy, is possible so long as the proper accidents happen during creation?
For instance, to go with High Fantasy, the evolution of beings capable or controlling latent energy flows scattered throughout their version of nature?
Hell, I'm getting annoyed just imagining it. It makes our universe so droll by comparison.
Theoretically, yes. Though the probability of carbon based lifeforms such as ourselves coming into existence is highly unlikely. We need water and in this "new" universe water may not even be physically possible to make as the structures and characteristics of the atoms themselves are changed. This extends to ALL elements in the universe.
The theory rests somewhere between the Big Bounce and a Multi-verse theory.
On the other hand, they wouldn't have to be carbon based, assuming a material such as carbon existed in that universe. It's about as likely, playing by different rules, for a different means to the same ends. Hell, we could be having this same conversation on another universal plane, except we're silica based.
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Spoiler:
Completely possible indeed. Hell, at the rate we're discovering how the universe(s) work, all we'll be doing is zooming out on a greater field that is part of another field and so on and so forth. Eventually we're going to hit a point where as humans we won't be able to conceive how it works. Science will try, because that is its nature. But everything had to begin somewhere. Am I saying an enitity(god) started it, no. What I am saying is that there is probably a reason without a reason how everything started. And when we hit the wall that tells us the reason, we just won't be able to understand it through our scope of logic and understanding as thinking animals.
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Another theory is that the universe goes through a reformation of some kind. The slim chance of the universe going through such a great and weird change that it begins engulfing our universe and creating a new one. Such a change would be like elements changing charges or something like that.
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I often read people giving the same old arguments "If god exists why he doesn't punish criminals and let children die?" and other moral questions. But it's not really relevant.
Expecting that a lone and almighty entity follow a moral system is foolish. Moral purpose is to set laws to help people living together without it turns to a total bloody mess. An alone and almighty entity has no points to follow any rule or social code. And you can't neither expect an almighty being thinks in the human way we define thinking, so refuting god existence by pointing moral consideration is not the best argument.
But it's also inappropriate to consider god do miracles. If a god exist, it's very unlikely he care about human more than about anything else he "created". Perhaps miracles exist but there is no evidence there are directly related to faith in a god. I'm pretty sure atheists or animists experience what we name miracles too.
There is chances that if a god exist we are to him what bacterias are to us, living in it and unnoticeable most of the time.
I'm agnostic by the way, not preaching for any side so.
Expecting that a lone and almighty entity follow a moral system is foolish. Moral purpose is to set laws to help people living together without it turns to a total bloody mess. An alone and almighty entity has no points to follow any rule or social code. And you can't neither expect an almighty being thinks in the human way we define thinking, so refuting god existence by pointing moral consideration is not the best argument.
But it's also inappropriate to consider god do miracles. If a god exist, it's very unlikely he care about human more than about anything else he "created". Perhaps miracles exist but there is no evidence there are directly related to faith in a god. I'm pretty sure atheists or animists experience what we name miracles too.
There is chances that if a god exist we are to him what bacterias are to us, living in it and unnoticeable most of the time.
I'm agnostic by the way, not preaching for any side so.
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Pocru wrote...
it had to start SOMEWHERE. Don't know if this was said, but it hasn't been proven yet, so feel free to believe as you wish. I personally believe something came from nothing. It's as likely as there having been a god to make everything.
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La_Mangouste wrote...
Perhaps miracles exist but there is no evidence there are directly related to faith in a god. I'm pretty sure atheists or animists experience what we name miracles too.Do you mean miracles are some kinda magic force/god power. I rather call it luck. Because miracles often is some power one help you. Like i have a friend that blame god for a friend survive an illness(miracles). And it sounds like "miracles" are stealing the achievement the doctor did do under the operation. Can we just say that we humans are it own success. And sometime we do something that just did so we survive that car accident.
razama wrote...
You can believe in evolution and a religion too, I actually know a lot of people like that.
When you people are mixing stuff like that is like making them own religion. It just make no sense that they believe in old scripts and at the same time deny the Adam and Eva thing. The reason I think people do that, is that they want an answer of the un-describable and the "ticket" to the next life.
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La_Mangouste wrote...
I often read people giving the same old arguments "If god exists why he doesn't punish criminals and let children die?" and other moral questions. But it's not really relevant.Expecting that a lone and almighty entity follow a moral system is foolish. Moral purpose is to set laws to help people living together without it turns to a total bloody mess. An alone and almighty entity has no points to follow any rule or social code. And you can't neither expect an almighty being thinks in the human way we define thinking, so refuting god existence by pointing moral consideration is not the best argument.
But it's also inappropriate to consider god do miracles. If a god exist, it's very unlikely he care about human more than about anything else he "created". Perhaps miracles exist but there is no evidence there are directly related to faith in a god. I'm pretty sure atheists or animists experience what we name miracles too.
There is chances that if a god exist we are to him what bacterias are to us, living in it and unnoticeable most of the time.
I'm agnostic by the way, not preaching for any side so.
"What is good or evil? How can God pass judgment on those who are evil, when its not God that has decided what is good or evil but society itself?"
I ask you, how can God pass judgment on criminals when it is society that has labeled them "criminals" not God.
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Pocru wrote...
...now, Im not a religious person by any definition. I get mad at most all of the catholic subbranches, Its getting harder and harder to view Islam impartially, and I just dont agree with all of the views of most every religion. There are contradictions and things that are unfair, and just plain ridiculous. ...but I'm not an atheist. I believe in god, but only for one reason, really. I've heard all of the atheist arguments, and none of them have ever addressed this, so Im curious if any of the many atheists on this site might have an idea.
The reason I'm not an atheist is because it had to start SOMEWHERE.
All of the theories behind man's creation, really...
like, for the big bang. What first created that atom that exploded to create all life? How did that thing just appear?
that's the biggest and only real convincing argument I have for the existence of god. I'd like to hear some people's theories opposing it.
thanks!
Okay im qouting pocru but also person dude too. think of God as the light or the great king who brought order to the chaos that is the nothingness that existed before he created the Heavens and we are not sure when God created us but he DID CUZ WE ARE HERE and he had to be all powerful because though we are fucked up we are supersmart powerful and vastly large yet minutely small in the vast universe. Oh and by the way there was technically a beginning when time was created as before the creation of time nothing as paralility or set corolatation of order existed in order to create said ability or set purpose if you will that is another reason i say God is all powerful as it would take almighty to conquer antithesis
GameON wrote...
La_Mangouste wrote...
I often read people giving the same old arguments "If god exists why he doesn't punish criminals and let children die?" and other moral questions. But it's not really relevant.Expecting that a lone and almighty entity follow a moral system is foolish. Moral purpose is to set laws to help people living together without it turns to a total bloody mess. An alone and almighty entity has no points to follow any rule or social code. And you can't neither expect an almighty being thinks in the human way we define thinking, so refuting god existence by pointing moral consideration is not the best argument.
But it's also inappropriate to consider god do miracles. If a god exist, it's very unlikely he care about human more than about anything else he "created". Perhaps miracles exist but there is no evidence there are directly related to faith in a god. I'm pretty sure atheists or animists experience what we name miracles too.
There is chances that if a god exist we are to him what bacterias are to us, living in it and unnoticeable most of the time.
I'm agnostic by the way, not preaching for any side so.
"What is good or evil? How can God pass judgment on those who are evil, when its not God that has decided what is good or evil but society itself?"
I ask you, how can God pass judgment on criminals when it is society that has labeled them "criminals" not God.
to qoute you both God does care and he does see wrong and it is by his means that truth could be defined. While God did create right and wrong the need for said laws was the chaos that was before creation. those laws are set into place in order to keep chaos from reigning again!! but on the other hand God sees that we cannot and will not ever attain perfection or order by regulation or logic they are merely tools. this is why he sent his son to die for all of us and i mean everyone. murderers rapist, whiteliars, thieves, you name it!! because God does hate all fault and sin but he sees that the only way truly handle it is not punishement but forgiveness but you must accept the gift he gives or it sits before you unopened. those who donot shall be thrown into the nothingness of hells fire and true oblivion theough never ceasing in agony while those who accepted his gift will attain perfection and reign with him in heaven over all!!! please send a personal message to me if this answers your questions!!!!
One lat thing before i log off. ROMAN CATHOLOCISM IS NOT CHRISTIANITY IT IS A CORRUPTION OF IT!!! SERIUOSLY LOOK UP THE ROMAN CATHOLIC HISTORY ITS FUCKED UP BADLY!!!
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Well im not an athiest im a southern babtist christian, bum bum bum buuuuuuum!!!
(not a very good one,but at least im not jehovahs witness lulz) any way the only reason i beleive is because thats how i was raised and beleving isnt going to hurt me right? if theres nothing afterdeath than hey it doesnt matter right. but if haven hell pergutorty and all that good shit really does exist than ill be better off than you athiest lulz.
(not a very good one,but at least im not jehovahs witness lulz) any way the only reason i beleive is because thats how i was raised and beleving isnt going to hurt me right? if theres nothing afterdeath than hey it doesnt matter right. but if haven hell pergutorty and all that good shit really does exist than ill be better off than you athiest lulz.