[Locked] Debate on Moving and Merging of Threads (Former Title: Paul)

I am okay with this.

Sorry, in my opinion it's simply chat section material. It's the reason the section exists.

User Note: We noticed your editing and the more intelligent of us have nothing to say about it as we have no control over this action.

Sorry for the inconvenience caused.

For the users who actually READ and at least TRIED to understand reasons for actions taken, I do applaud your sensibility. I really shouldn't have to though, because people should act rationally. So in reality I am mostly applauding you in order to lead into a chastisement for the other users.

To the other users who did not bother reading any of the other mods' posts and instead put their fingers in their ears and said "lalala fuck the system" or "you only moved it because of [incorrect] (reason)?" or even "our thread deserves special treatment because it has an intrinsic value to us", you should really do some introspection. If you're petitioning for something, or even debating, you need to present a coherent, related, and valid point. It's a bit sad to see the only such instance presented to both Mattarat and my posts was by Haronitar, who doesn't even support your position. You guys sure are quick to jump all over waar "strong-arming his opinion" but honestly I doubt your subsequent narrow-minded bloodrage is much better.

You're cool... /sarcasm

At this point I don't even care anymore.

Honestly, Gambler's way of approaching things are the best so far in Fakku.

OT: Thanks for giving us the chance, Gambler!
If this one does not work too then by all means move it to CTFG.
But please, don't use "I think it's best to be moved to CTFG because I think so and the other mods agree with it" because that kind of reasoning does not help and it pisses us users off. I'm not saying Waar did this, just a train of thought

At the moment, it is only a proposal or suggestion. It has not been vetted or approved by the top management and other staff members.

Bloodrage.

Mods pissing off users is a sign they have done their jobs.

I don't understand, I gave my reasoning. I was then asked to ask the other staff members and so I did. Now you want me to ignore what the other staff think and not use it as reasoning because they didn't agree with the users? What else would you like me/us to base this decision on?

So far i've seen a lot of 'because i'm the mod and i say so', and snide comments in a vain attempt to sound like they're not just flexing their authority. then, much later, after increasing pressure from the comunity, it was followed by a legitimate explination... and more snotty attitudes. even when Gambler attempts to reach some kind of compromise, it's shot down out of shear spite, followed by more failed attempts at witticism.



i cannot think of a more apt metaphore.


edit:4/10/12(because i was gone when this thread was locked)
the fact that even though i didn't name any names, your compulsion to try and defend/justify your behaviour validates my point.

almost from the start, my problem has been the how, not the what. the overall attitude and the way the people who complained were treated was unproffesional and just plain rude.

It wasn't "im a mod and I say so", it was "rate threads go in the chat section because they always have since it's inception"(it's the reason the section exists). What makes you think it's out of spite? You won't accept the reasoning but it doesn't make the reasoning invalid, you simply don't like it. I still don't see a reason why the guidelines we have set down for us should be ignored? Because you want us to? You're the most clear cut example of unexplained and incomprehensible hate in this entire thread, and you serve as a disservice to the side of this debate you represent.

I would like all questions and concerns to be brought to my attention first Waar. I am the voice of the people.

Seriously now. This issue keeps on bugging my conscience for two days now. I want to help solve this issue, as well. I am doing this not only for the sake of the users, but also for the sake of the community itself.

Waar already admitted that the merging of those two threads was really a mistake, but he can't do anything about it. Even so, you people can just create a new thread with the same topic. Now, the remaining issue is whether that thread should be moved or not.

Let me first quote what Hobogunner posted on the first page of this thread.




I believe post count is not the only issue here. The forums would be messed up if we are going to disregard the nature of posts. We have the I.B. section for the unintelligent, incoherent, and casual discussion. We also have different forum sections, so that people who have the same specific kind of interest would be able to share it with one another. If it means nothing for you, it doesn't mean it would also apply to other users. You can't stop the general perception of the whole community that post count really matters. It has been like this for a long time now ever since this site was created.

I am not sure about the exact purpose of post counts, but my assumption is that it makes users to become more active in the forums by gaining a fame/title. That being active in the forums has either a good or bad effect on the community. You are active but the thing is you are just being active on trolling other users. It is an entirely different thing from an active user who contributes/participates in the community in a decent manner. This is why we have rules to follow in the forums, so that we would have a productive and organized community.

We should stop assuming that we are the only ones who are accessing this website, especially the forums. I know for sure that there are really people who are immature, in a way that they only think of is gaining fame on this website through the means of raising their post counts or gaining reputation points. They can use that thread or other similar threads to boost their post counts. That is tolerable, as long as they do it on a decent manner.

We want people who are truly serious on a particular topic to discuss it in a decent manner. Do you consider a thread full of posts comprising only of numbers and phrases as a decent discussion? I think it is not. A chat thread is different from a thread with a specific topic. The former is mostly casual in manner, while on the other hand it has a specific topic that should be discussed.


I really want to know why you people want to stick that thread on the music section. Nevertheless, I can provide justification for the moderators' side.

If you just rated a song without any explanations, I would think that you didn't listen to it at all. Actually, Gambler's proposal is favorable to you guys. It will make the discussion more productive. If you want to raise your post counts by using that means, then go ahead. It is an intelligent discussion, I suppose. On the other hand, you people might think that you want it on the music section, so that music enthusiasts would be able to see your thread right away and join the discussion. The only problem is that there will eventually be some users who will post on that thread by just rating the music videos. This is where the role of the users and the moderators will take place. The users can report whoever didn't follow the standard format for that thread. I believe it isn't that troublesome for the moderators, since there are only a few of you (10) who are regular posters on that thread. The moderators don't need to check each post for goodness sake. They have other things to do, I know that for sure.

Sacrifices, or better yet, responsibilities is inevitable for both sides in order to compromise on this issue at hand.


NOTE: I observed that the issue is being diverted. We should not take these things personally. You are attacking the moderator himself and not the prevailing issue.

No no I wasn't saying you did not give your reasoning. I was saying that if you and the other mods agree with it, please explain it more briefly like "We mods agree that this thread should be moved because it contains blablablablablah".



See the difference? That's what I meant.

So somehow me pointing out devsonfire's and Kouki's (and to a lesser extent GameON) glazing over of other moderator's explanations = snotty attitudes and failed attempts at witticism? What.
Am I somehow not allowed to be genuinely upset that both me and Mattarat provided detailed explanations which (by the users previously mentioned) were ignored? That these users continued to harp on points no longer relevant (waar's "powermongering")? And I'm somehow not supposed to be more upset that you come in here and call them "snide comments" and "failed attempts at witticism"?
Really, who here has the "snide comments" and "snotty attitudes"?

Also, the only moderator who ever even said anything remotely close to "i'm the mod and i say so" was waar, and that's a pretty oversimplified interpretation.

You know, just because we disagree with you doesn't make us bad people or power mongers.



That's what we did. Not my fault you didn't read it.

Ah, so that's why I can't find that one particular thread in music section.
So, how's the final conclusion? No more "rate" thread outside Chat and Whatever section or do we follow Gambler's suggestion?

Nah, go to CTFG.
Ryssen did exactly what Gambler has suggested and the thread is still moved anyway.
At this point people don't really give a fuck anymore. It's about making an excuse to get away with it.
What I care about now is Man United fighting for Premier League title against Man City!

It's still under debate, seems Gambler would like to wait for Jacob.