User Posts

PersonDude wrote...
Sorry for the sardonic post, but really disappointed in how you responded. Guess the disappointment comes from having thought you were a chill guy.


Yeah, I guess I went too far that time bro, my bad. My mood depends on my financial condition and these past three days I was so broke, fucking Aladdin was like the prince of Bel-Air compared to me. That post was mainly directed at Souls though, at least you were trying to argue reasonably provided with notable points while he just troll shits like "lololol GW is Saber deal with it nerd" without providing any counter argument of his own.
But rest assured, I'm high on cigs now so I won't sound like a pissy bitch this time (But I doubt I can write properly this time). Let me get my thoughts together and I hope I can get my points across.

EmiyaKiritsugu wrote...

Naw. He be high strung. He is a chill guy. He fandomed over making a hero precise to the legends when he forgot Nasu-shroom tweaks the stories of all the various mythologies he's come across for Fate to fit the servants' classes.
So I guess somesome was sorta an asshole this time. DX


Nah, I didn't forget that. I wrote it in my previous post that with Nasu's lolwriting anyone can become any Servant. And yes, you were right, I was being precise, too precise even. What I wanted to say is if we based GW from our current historical records then he couldn't become a Saber. But if Nasu decided to put any tweaks on his history on how he was faring with his swords then yes, he could become one.

Now allow me to straighten things up. Incoming wall of text.
Spoiler:

PersonDude wrote...
somesome wrote...
Gil can be an Archer because he can shoot his Noble Phantasms from his vault.


But you said:

somesome wrote...
Could I become Archer, when I don't have anything else besides "I CAN SHOOT ANYTHING FROM 100 YARDS GODDAMN I'M AWESOME"?


Double meaning much? Ambiguity is not cool bro.


What I was trying to say is having archery skills is not enough to become a servant of the bow. It's like having many talents, but you only excel in specific talents that later becomes your main strength, and in heroic spirit somes' case(fuck, I chortled) archery isn't one of them, although history recorded that I'm good at archery. We'll compare myself with Gil since we're both FABULOUS.

On Gil's case, his first NP is Gate of Babylon. That thing shoots NPs. With mystery and ranks and various effects and all. It's ranked E-A++.
Gil's another NP is Ea. Well I don't know if he can whack things with it, but so far all it does is shoot death beams. It's ranked EX.
Both NPs have long range and they sustained a mystery rank required for being a conceptual weapon, so yes, he's eligible for Archer.

On the other hand, me, I'm a heroic rapist on a legendary rapist horse. Sure I can shoot, give me a bow and arrows and I can show you my skills. But that's it. I'm most famous for my girth and horse, not my bows. People might say "oh, so he's good with bows too, awesome." but that's it. I don't have some famous ranked projectile weapons that contain legend or mystery or magic. I don't have anything special other than above average shooting skill that a lot of heroes of the old age seem to possess too. Do you get what I'm trying to say here?

In GW's case here, he was known as the first president of United States. He was known as a general, politician, whatever. He was not known as an expert swordman that killed hundreds of enemies with his sword. Sure, he's famous for his swordmanship, but anyone can be a master swordsman too. In the links Souls provided it's said that there's no direct evidence of GW dueling or fighting battle mainly using swords. That means his swordmanship is not notable enough. Just like the heroic rapist somes who "has a legendary horse that shits thunder and eat babies. Oh and he's good with swords and bows too", GW is also "the first president of United States who is a good general. Oh and he's good with swords too". Unless Nasu wants to make importance of his swords then he can be "the first president of United States with a sword he used when [insert Nasu fanfic here]" thus eligible for a Saber class, because now he has something worthy of note, something with mystery or significance in history, which is a Noble Phantasm that defines him from other classes. Now let's talk about NPs.

NPs are the main factor considered by the Fuyuki Grail system to define the heroic spirits to enter the Holy Grail vessels known as Class. If I don't have any extraordinary feats using my bow/sword, then I can't be inserted in Archer/Saber class even when I'm pro using them. I'll just be known as "the Rider who can use swords and shoot arrows too". Unless if there's a tale of me coating my arrows with my cum and knocked up every single girl in the dorm by shooting at their cunts, then BAM, legend with bows, NP achieved: Impregnarrows, rank EX, only effective against female, therefore I can be Archer.
Whoa, that would be awesome.

Ahem, anyway, that's what I mean by skills alone isn't enough. Let's take an ingame case from our dear Arturia now.
Looking at F/Z stats, she has A rank Riding skill. A rank means she can ride anything, from airplane to motorcycle and my dick, with the exception of Phantasmal Beasts.
But in the VN it's clearly said that she could only be summoned as Saber. Now this is the important part. The question is why? Why not Rider?
Once again it's the NP factor. Excalibur is her most famous sword. It's written in everywhere, manga, games, novels, you name it. And looking at the HGW rules, if that's not a certain pass to Saber class, I don't know what is. Plus she doesn't have any ride worthy of legend. Arthur had Llamrei and Hengroen, but they're just ordinary horses with no special traits recorded in history, why bother summoning them why you can just say fuck it and jack some motorcycle? Wait, do they bear significance in Arthur's legend in the first place?

Now we're making a what-if scenario using heroic rapist somes. Let's say that I can be Archer, and I got summoned as such by a female magus who looks like Taylor Swift.

Master(M): My, mister Servant, you're so handsome. Mind if I know what Servant class are you?
Somes(S): Sure, why don't I tell you that in your bedroom?
-After two hours of passionate lovemaking-
S: I guess I can tell you now that I'm an Archer.
M: Wow, and what is your ability?
S: I have a horse.
M: What?
S: Mmm hmm.
M: Aren't Archers supposed to have abilities with long range weapons?
S: Well, I'm very good with my bow.
M: Oh, cool. What kind of arrows do you shoot?
S: What kind of arrows do I shoot?
M: Uhm, magical arrows? Cursed arrows? Or any kind of special Noble Phantasm.. Have any legends concerning arrows?
S: Uh no, just 'arrow' arrows. And sometimes flagpoles too.
M: What? Ordinary arrows? So you don't have any Noble Phantasm?
S: I have my legendary horse.
M: You shoot your horse?
S: No, silly. I ride it. Then I shoot my enemies with my arrows.
M: ..Ordinary arrows..
S: ..and flagpoles. That's a smart Master. You get another creampie as a reward.
M: If you have a legendary horse that's more famous than your skill with bows, why aren't you a Rider in the first place?
S: And why aren't you sucking my dick in the first place? Look at the bright side, now the enemy Masters won't find out my identity from my attacks alone.
M: They won't give a shit about it either.
-For Saber scenario, replace 'bow' and 'arrow' with 'sword' and 'shoot' with 'cut'-

Now you might think I'm getting a bit drunk now since I'm getting less serious, because that's true. But I was just making an example and I also wanted to bang Taylor Swift so yeah. I hope my explanation makes sense because when I checked my writings I cringed at all those unfunny jokes.

Now let's talk about Emiya's qualification as a Servant here. He's a CG. But what's important is Emiya Shirou's alignment according to Fate CM 3 which is Swords. Let's clear any misunderstanding here first. Having 'Sword' as affinity does not equal being a heroic spirit of swords. MAYBE he could become Saber, but that's another story and another fanwank until Nasu says so. Let's look at what his abilities can do.
First is tracing. Tracing allows you to recreate Noble Phantasms. Which is a fuckawesomethisisthebestthingevergoddamn ability. Many people underestimate tracing because let's be honest, compared to a reality ripping beam or a pegasus creating swords is just lame. But we often forgot tracing can be exploited by using BPs, the ability that ensures his position as an Archer.
BP is a NP that's overloaded with mana and used as a final trump card. And he can use it over and over as an arrow. It's more effective than tracing swords and using it in melee battle. He's clearly shown favoring BP than meleeing in both SN and HA and that pretty much strengthen his qualification as Archer. CG Emiya with backup from Alaya is pretty much the most fucked up thing you could ever imagine.
Now let's talk about UBW. Simply put, it's his main ability. Tracing is only a byproduct of it. Can he be summoned as Saber since his origin is Sword and he's only proficient in making swords? Well in the VN Shirou thought that Archer's swordmanship is crude and he even thought of himself more of a craftman than a swordman, so honestly, I don't know. It's a dangerous field to touch and can result into another shitfest, so let's not talk about that. But can he surely be summoned as Archer? You bet your ass he can, he was a star in his archery club and he shoots exploding swords with his bow, he can't get more archer-like than that.

Regarding your statement on Ea not being Gil's strongest NP, I'm curious about where did you get that from. Ea and Enkidu are the NPs that define his identity as a Heroic Spirit, and so far it's said in the side materials as the strongest NP with a maximum output of 4000 damage, and although Gil can only pull off 1200 damage it's still completely overwhelming compared to normal NPs with an average damage of 200. Gil always use Ea whenever he respect an enemy, getting serious, or getting fucked. It's basically his trump card. I can't figure out any NP that can deal with that except Avalon, and he doesn't have it, so if you know something I don't, please do tell.

And lastly, lol wat. As I said before I prefer Abraham Lincoln as a president. He was a cool guy, he free niggas and doesn't afraid of anything. He's more famous than GW outside of America.

Lastly, PD, I've been wanting to ask you since forever, but you went inactive for so long I thought you were dead.
Can I get source on your avatar?
Akasen wrote...
somesome wrote...
Souls wrote...
somesome wrote...
I even pray that Nasu someday will grant your wish and have your dear president featured in one of his work



That would be cool, wouldn't it?


Hmm, not really. Despite his big accomplishment, his history is not too old and he's not that well known outside US, so his overall stats must be pretty bad. Besides Abe Lincoln is better.


Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter!


I've never read that book since I thought it was silly. Is it good?
Souls wrote...
somesome wrote...
I even pray that Nasu someday will grant your wish and have your dear president featured in one of his work



That would be cool, wouldn't it?


Hmm, not really. Despite his big accomplishment, his history is not too old and he's not that well known outside US, so his overall stats must be pretty bad. Besides Abe Lincoln is better.
Souls wrote...

>Implying anyone you named can't be a Saber


BUT THEY CAN'T YOU FUCKING IDIOT. (save for St. George)

Fucking shit, now I understand the problem. You just don't know anything! Good heavens, that's why we never came into agreement, because you used our own made up fanfiction.net level imagination.

Let's fucking play along. Let's say that anyone who is proficient with swords can be summoned as Saber, fine. I hope this logic I'm going to teach you goes through your adamantium skull.

Let's say I am a fucking legendary hero. I can use swords like a fucking Jedi, killing people like pro. I also can shoot your face from 100 yards with my bow. BUT I'm most famous for having a pimp ride, a 10 foot stallion that shits thunder and eats babies. Do you think I can be summoned in the Grail War as a fucking Saber or Archer? FUCK NO, I would tell my Master to go suck a dick and die, why?

NOBLE PHANTASM, remember? The weapon that defines the heroic spirit, symbol of their identity? Fuck, why would I become something other than Rider, when my symbol of legend, my pimp horse, can't have Rider stats buff? What's the fucking use if there's someone else, a Rider, who also has a ride that can outrun me? Could I become a Saber, while my sword is just some ordinary sword I got from my fans which has no mystery factor to define its rank? Could I become Archer, when I don't have anything else besides "I CAN SHOOT ANYTHING FROM 100 YARDS GODDAMN I'M AWESOME"? If I play basketball with my friends every Sunday, does that make me qualified as a NBA player? I'm pretty good with my three pointers, you know. Just like Francis Drake is pretty good with her cutlass, I'd say.

Drake is a Rider because she's famous for her fleet and rides a ship.
Iskandar is a Rider because he's famous for his army and rides Bucephalus.
Gil can be an Archer because he can shoot his Noble Phantasms from his vault.
Emiya is an Archer despite always wielding Kanshou and Bakuya because he shoots Broken Phantasm and Shirou was a good archer in his school, and his swordmanship is shit compared to other people.
Heracles can be anything but Caster because he can use his Nine Lives NP with fucking anything. Bow, sword, spear, even your mom.
Arturia has a riding skill yet she can never become a Rider. Arthur depicted in a drawing killed Mordred with a spear, yet she can never become Lancer. She can only be summoned as a Saber.

I don't care anymore if you keep fanwanking Washington or whatever. I even pray that Nasu someday will grant your wish and have your dear president featured in one of his work so you can shut the fuck up and end my misery. Right now I just want you to get your facts straight instead of making shit up with your limited knowledge and faggotry. BEING PROFICIENT IN A CERTAIN WEAPON SUCH AS SWORDS OR SPEARS OR BOWS ALONE DOES NOT QUALIFY A HERO FOR BEING A KNIGHT CLASS SERVANT. EITHER YOU MAKE A LEGEND WITH YOUR WEAPON OR YOU MAKE A LEGEND WITH YOUR SKILLS ON WEAPONS.

edit: I wanted to explain more about Emiya since he's a special case, but I can't think of some way to explain it without spoonfeeding newfags.
It's already out yet no one made any thread?
http://www.illusion.jp/preview/wakeari/index.html

Wiki page
http://scratchpad.wikia.com/wiki/Wakeari_General_Gameplay

IMO this game is better than Artificial Academy so far. It has story, more options on sexual intercourse, and more gameplay than just talk-friend-like-sex. Although the art style put me off at the first 30 minutes, now I'm loving the character designs. It doesn't offer free customization like Artificial Girl, but it has one interesting feature which is the Ghost Hunting mode. From looking at the wiki alone I'm interested to try various effects the ghosts can give to the girls and MC. So far I'm having a good time with this game.

Who else is playing this right now? Everyone is welcomed to give comments and share tips and experience.
PersonDude wrote...

Not sure what you mean. Western culture was not the only civilization around during that period. Furthermore, don't forget the Mage's Association and the church were around during that period in Nasuverse as well. In history, we may not know who belonged in these groups but we can use our imagination just as well as
Nasu did. :)

Also, G. Washington is known to have been a Freemason which has many conspiracy theories involved with the group as a secret society. Portrayed similarly to the Illuminati which might make his story more interesting.


It's from Nasu's lolwriting about how in modern era heroic deeds are no longer considered spectacular thanks to technology, and if a gunslinger is considered famous it's not because of his own skill but rather the capabilities of his guns, thus the guns will be the ones that become Heroic Spirits, it was in the second Character Material iirc. It's nearly impossible for people who live in era of guns and science to believe in gods or heroes anymore, thus creating less legends and legendary figures.
And I guess you're right about the Freemason background, it is really exploitable for adding original settings.

PersonDude wrote...

If this were the way servants were categorized into class, then Gilgamesh wouldn't be Archer.

IMO G. Washington would be perfect as many of the historical documentation of the Revelutionary era were lost which leaves it open for your own interpretation. We can't completely rely on legends and history alone, as Nasu misconstrued many a lengend and history himself to write his novels.


Bro, you missed the reason why me and kaimax went so far explaining things to him. Anyone can be anything with Nasu's lolwriting but we were looking from currently existing sources here. If the words of Nasu is used as an excuse then I can just use some Japanese samurai character and claim he's a Saber/Rider/whatever because lol Nasu will provide a background story to make it reasonable later.
Souls wrote...
somesome wrote...
Why didn't you answer my question huh? Did George Washington ever do something heroic with those five swords?


Well to be more detailed, you said

somesome wrote...
did he ever have a name for his sword or achieve heroic feats using it more than a rifle?


And i provided the names for his swords.
OR means one or the other, not both.


somesome wrote...
And you seriously believe any Fate/Extra character is a good basis for any kind of Servant qualification argument?


Good or not is pure opinion. While the fact is they are canon


... I am being trolled, am I? I'll bite one last time.

First of all, good job for misunderstanding my post and using my words for your advantage. Let me explain what I meant in my first question. Saber was known for her Excalibur. Siegfried was known for Balmung. Was George Washington known for his swords? Did he gain name from those swords? No? That means he doesn't pass any of those two conditions. From what I read in that article, most of those swords were bought by the people who gave them to him, and some are clearly stated as decorative swords. Wow, special swords indeed.

I didn't say Fate/Extra is bad for comparison out of my opinion. It is a fact that:
1.Fate/Extra's Grail system is different than the normal HGW
2.Many Servants summoned in Extra's Grail doesn't qualify as Servants in normal HGW
3.OP wanted a Servant thread with the usual Fuyuki HGW rules (real legends, classifications according to historical records, etc) except for the Hassan= Assassin rule

Therefore, it is a fact that using a Servant summoned by a different kind of Grail as an example for this thread is BAD. No, it's not pure opinion. It's a fact that it's bad using Nero or any Extra Servant for your argument because you're comparing apple to orange.
On the other hand, you thinking of George qualifies as Saber no matter what people said, now that's an opinion.

I wonder if you really know about Nasuverse when all you can do is spout IT'S THERE SO IT'S CANON SO IT'S TRUE while disregarding the facts stated in the source material AND this thread. So I guess Arcueid can be summoned as a Servant is canon because she's summoned in Extra? What's next, Satsujinki? Ryougi Shiki?
I'll just hope George Washington will really become a character in some Fate/Whateverspinoff Nasu shits on so you can jerk off happily and stop giving me headache from your baseless assumptions.

kickiluxxx wrote...

George Washington, on the other hand, would only his sword (I think it's a saber) when:
1. He's out of ammunition, and
2. His enemies managed to get close
Looking at his battles and the way he fights them, his weapon of preference (even me at that time) is still a gun. He won't charge an opposing army with a sword. He loves hit and run.
George is a nice servant, but he can only go as an archer class. He can use a sword but he'll be like Gilgamesh.


even OP agreed, don't bother with him.

I can't believe I'm wasting my time arguing about something this useless. I'll give a 7/10, good job. Sorry for derailing your thread OP, this will be my last post about this George Washington fanfiction here, I swear.
Souls wrote...
Kaimax wrote...
Souls wrote...
somesome wrote...
did he ever have a name for his sword or achieve heroic feats using it more than a rifle?


http://www.revolutionarywararchives.org/washsword.html

Happy? He had not one, not two, not three, but five, five famous swords.


Most are just ceremonial swords and dress swords. Which is obviously never intended to be used in combat.

and once again Nero is one of the worst Saber Nasu has ever created. It was created mostly because of Business decision. It's a good decision, but it just lacks the consistent quality of a "saber".



http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Did_George_Washington_know_how_to_fight_with_a_sword


Also whether Saber Nero is consistent or not, it was created by Nasu and is fully canon. Your opinion on the matter is invalid.


HAHAHA, OH WOW
While there is no direct evidence that he had participated in any sword fighting in either duels or battles,


That's enough proof alright.
And you seriously believe any Fate/Extra character is a good basis for any kind of Servant qualification argument?
Why didn't you answer my question huh? Did George Washington ever do something heroic with those five swords?
But seeing Joan as Ruler can be Saber too, so there, have your made up Saber. Happy?
I'm outta here.
Souls wrote...
somesome wrote...
did he ever have a name for his sword or achieve heroic feats using it more than a rifle?


http://www.revolutionarywararchives.org/washsword.html

Happy? He had not one, not two, not three, but five, five famous swords.


Why do you always ignore the most important points?
Kaimax wrote...

What weapon did George use to unify the country?
Guns, rifles, cannons. If you can find a reliable source that they used swords more than guns and rifles, I'll accept it.


His point is it's nearly impossible for people who lived in the era of firearms to be qualified as Heroic Spirits because people hardly believe in magic anymore, and normal soldiers can achieve more feats than old heroes thanks to firearms.


Did he liberate the United States using swords? Had he ever done any heroic feats using those swords?

Kaimax wrote...
he might just fall into the newest class, Ruler
Oh look, it's THIS thread.

Souls wrote...
Kaimax wrote...
Souls wrote...
Kaimax wrote...
Souls wrote...

He was as good with a sword as Nero was, if not better (probably better) and Nero is in the Saber class. So i stand by my post.


The question, was he "famous" enough with the sword?

Nero's wars was fought with swords, GW's wars was fought with rifles.


You're telling me Nero himself was famous with a sword?


you're ignoring my 2nd sentence.

and just because he can use a sword, doesn't always mean he's good at them. Look at all the other existing Sabers, most of them are famous for their swordsmanship.

What weapon did George use to unify the country?
Guns, rifles, cannons. If you can find a reliable source that they used swords more than guns and rifles, I'll accept it.

if you can't, the it shows that you just wanted him to be Saber because you like the Saber class.

Honestly Nero, is the worst Saber example. She was just made because "Sabers are cool."


Nero being Saber is canon, Nero isn't known for being good with a sword either, yet he is Saber. So there is no reason to think George Washington can't be a saber either.


His point is it's nearly impossible for people who lived in the era of firearms to be qualified as Heroic Spirits because people hardly believe in magic anymore, and normal soldiers can achieve more feats than old heroes thanks to firearms. Nero passed as Saber because the Grail's system in Fate/Extra is different than SN and Nasu's lolwriting gave her an original sword which is also her RM. Even if George was known for his swordmanship, did he ever have a name for his sword or achieve heroic feats using it more than a rifle? If yes, then according to OP's rules he could be Saber, if not then try another class. By your logic any historical figure can be Saber as long as they were shown carrying a sword in their picture.
lordsparda09 wrote...
zeroniv_legend wrote...
lordsparda09 wrote...
what no Kara no Kyoukai , Ryougi Shiki is enough.


Seconded.
She can kill anything in a single blow.
Which reminds me, if she uses a rifle, then aims at the target's point of death, would that also be an instant death as well?


Actually she attacks the point of origin instead of point of death , she can even kill immortals like Arcueid that Tohno/nanaya can't kill.


Wait what.

Ryougi and Tohno's perception on death are different. Ryougi sees lines. Tohno sees points that spread into lines.
MEoDP and Void Shiki's ability are two different things. There is no such thing as point of origin. Nothing is said or shown anywhere that she utilized her "destroy and recreate everything" power by using her eyes.
Her famous quote "If it's alive, I can kill god"? That's a bluff and said just for adding cool factor like "ROW ROW FIGHT THE POWAH". She can't see lines on Archetype Earth. She can't kill Types. She can't kill immortals that don't have a concept of death in the first place.
Next time, don't just post copy pasta from typemoon wiki and read the source material please.

PersonDude wrote...

Nasuverse is known for having characters holding crazy hacks ace in the hole in their pockets. Not many other universes could probably beat it lol.


DC.
Spoiler:

Batman with enough prep time > *
Search in your heart.
You know it's true.
Reading this thread makes me cringe.
MegaTenLove wrote...
Also, it's cool to share and share alike, and things being what they are (shit economy, shit job market, body needs food and shelter more than games, etc.) I understand why you'd go down the emulator route, but please support the official release when you can. The translation is actually pretty good and the Limited Edition is a fuck ton cheaper than it could've been, but more importantly: The more Fate Extra sells the more likely Aksys Games can get the license to bring over Fate Extra CCC, and that's what really matters.


Rest assured, I just wanted to point out that an emulator exists for quite some time. I won't give any links or help regarding the emulator or the ISO since this isn't the appropriate place, besides it's been spread around on the internet and people with a bit of effort and intelligence can google them anyway. I would buy it since I'm a huge TM fan, but like you said, situations forced me to giving up on buying this game.
Spoiler:
(which in my case my PSP got stolen, can't find it anywhere near my place hence I have to order it from overseas which costs a lot plus it's a pain to take it out from customs, and I'm saving my money for all the Saber figures I preordered.)


Never bothered raising other stats like AGI. LUK works better for grinding anyway, combined with gain_lck skill I always deal critical damage most of the time. I kind of wondered about raising MAG though since I don't know if MAG is important for Archer's skill or is it useful against Caster.
Sup.
Spoiler:
Forum Image: https://www.fakku.net/image-404/images/732940-560S9T3.jpg

Forum Image: http://niveloculto.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/LazyTown+you_are_a_pirate-300x224.jpg



Currently playing as female with Archer. dumped everything on STR and DEF and about to fight Caster, should I raise MAG?
Kaimax wrote...
somesome wrote...
and there's an article about Fate/Apocrypha project running.


I thought it was cancelled for good.


I didn't believe in my shitty Japanese reading skills either, but then I checked ANN.
http://www.typemoon.com/
Type-Moon Ace vol. 7 will include a demo CD of Mahoyo, and there's an article about Fate/Apocrypha project running.

Really now? I'm happy for Mahoyo, but Apocrypha? Where's Girls' Work? Did they ever work on something else beside this shit, something original once in a while?
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